6238  Smooth Tango :: Two tone wingtips do not a leader

ARTICLE INDEX


Date: Fri, 6 Feb 2009 08:33:59 -0600
From: "Alex" <alex@tangofuego.us>
Subject: [Tango-L] Smooth Tango :: Two tone wingtips do not a leader
make

Klaus (Wien) wrote: [as "Smooth Tango"]

.Over recent time I have watched Mario search to find dancers, and
.dances, that move him - though often I do find myself not in
.agreement with his choice. Then my sister pointed out this guy on
.youtube to me (see links under) She says she luckily danced with him
.in Poland once. I do agree with her - smooth, musically inventing,
.passionate and close connected. Maybe one day I can dance so smooth ..
.practice, practice?


I, too, was never impressed with anything from Mario, but I would also have
to say I was not impressed with the dancing of this gentleman (In Klaus'
videos). I didn't see anything "smooth, musically inventive, passionate, and
close connected". I didn't see anything that I would "admire" or "aspire to"
in his dancing.

But then again, he is dancing open embrace/salon style, and only momentarily
coming into close embrace from the few seconds of each video I watched. I
aspire to close embrace, milonguero style. If Klaus' example leader is
"close connected", then what I aspire to is dancing inside of each other's
souls.

I'm just offering a differing/dissenting opinion - It's interesting how some
can see a dancer as someone they want to emulate, and others, like me, as
seeing the same dancer as 'good, but not great'. Perhaps this is natural in
the evolution of each individual's tango path.

The following video, of Osvaldo Zotto y Lorena Ermocida (in Confiteria
Ideal) to me, *is* "smooth, musically inventive, passionate, and close
connected" :: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l9mGaSPm97A although it's
obviously not milonguero style. Ricardo Vidort would fall into that
category.

There are lots of other examples (of smooth tango) out there as well.

Alex
www.alextangofuego.blogspot.com







Date: Fri, 6 Feb 2009 10:00:48 -0600
From: "Alex" <alex@tangofuego.us>
Subject: Re: [Tango-L] Smooth Tango :: Two tone wingtips do not a
leader make
To: "'Richard Isaacs'" <RBIsaacs@attglobal.net>, "'Tango-L'"

Hola Richard,

No I didn't write that document...will have to read it later...running out
the door...

That may be my bad as far as equating salon to open and milonguero to
close... that's what I've been taught by the multitude of teachers I've
studied with...and gleaned from the research I've done...

That salon and close embrace are danced to different tempos - this is the
first time I have ever heard this...

A better way to say it may be that close embrace almost never compromises
the embrace...and salon almost always compromises the embrace...am I wrong
about this?

I think part of the difficulty in communicating about tango is that we all
have different perceptions and understandings about the various terminology
and pedagogy....

I've been dancing for 4-1/2 years, but still consider myself a
beginner...and will for another 8 years or so... 10,000 hours or 12 years,
whichever comes first, seems to be the cusp...

Take care,

Alex
www.alextangofuego.blogspot.com


-----Original Message-----



From: Richard
Sent: Friday, February 06, 2009 9:37 AM
To: Alex
Subject: Re: [Tango-L] Smooth Tango :: Two tone wingtips do not a leader
make

Friday, February 6, 2009, 9:33:59 AM, you wrote:

A> But then again, he is dancing open embrace/salon style, and only
momentarily
A> coming into close embrace from the few seconds of each video I watched. I
A> aspire to close embrace, milonguero style.

Alex -

One of the things that continues to astonish me is that many beginning
dancers -- and for all I know many experienced dancers -- think that
if you are holding your partner close to you, then you are dancing
close embrace. In fact, in salon tango you are pressed against your
partner until you need to do a figure (front ochos spring to mind)
where the embrace needs to breathe. Close embrace itself doesn't open
up, uses a subset of the figures of salon tango, and is danced at a
slightly different tempo than salon tango.

Regards/Richard

PS - I have attached the latest version of a document I received.
Which, for all I know, you wrote.







Date: Sun, 8 Feb 2009 14:31:46 +1000
From: Tango22 <tango22@gmail.com>
Subject: [Tango-L] Smooth Tango :: Two tone wingtips do not a leader
make
To: tango-l@mit.edu

Richard,
Since when can't you execute a front ocho in a tango embrace? I agree
that open-embrace adopts an expanded set of (usually rote-learned)
figures comprising a number of steps, mostly adaptations of
performance or demonstration (no judgement intended here). Close-
embrace is not based on figures at all, but technique, from which
figures are created as you dance, responding to the music, your
partner and the other dancers; perhaps never to be repeated. Would
you kindly explain what you mean by "dancing to a different tempo". I
would have thought that the music always dictates the tempo / rhythm /
feel of every dance.
John


On 07/02/2009, at 3:24 AM, tango-l-request@mit.edu wrote:

> From: Richard
> Sent: Friday, February 06, 2009 9:37 AM
> ....... In fact, in salon tango you are pressed against your
> partner until you need to do a figure (front ochos spring to mind)
> where the embrace needs to breathe. Close embrace itself doesn't
> open up, uses a subset of the figures of salon tango, and is danced
> at a slightly different tempo than salon tango.






Date: Mon, 9 Feb 2009 17:28:56 -0600
From: Joe Grohens <joe.grohens@gmail.com>
Subject: [Tango-L] Smooth Tango :: Two tone wingtips do not a leader
make
To: tango-l@mit.edu
Cc: Joe Grohens <joe.grohens@gmail.com>

Alex quotes Richard who says:

> Alex - One of the things that continues to astonish me is that many
> beginning dancers -- and for all I know many experienced dancers --
> think that if you are holding your partner close to you, then you
> are dancing close embrace. In fact,

> in salon tango you are pressed against your partner until you need
> to do a figure (front ochos spring to mind) where the embrace needs
> to breathe.

> Close embrace itself doesn't open up, uses a subset of the figures
> of salon tango, and is danced at a slightly different tempo than
> salon tango.

When I read authoritative-sounding definitions like this I wonder
where they came from. Not from Argentina, I suspect.

And it reminds me that Daniel Trenner will give a lecture in a few
days at Valentango on the "History & Development of Tango in the U.S."

I really wish I could go. (I really hope his talk will be published.)

I would like to ask Daniel where the term "Close Embrace Tango" came
from, and who defined it, and what it originally meant.

I am not disputing the definition given by Richard, but just wondering
where this term came from.





Continue to Explaining the feeling of community in Argentine | ARTICLE INDEX