4481 tango to the blues
Date: Thu, 13 Jul 2006 13:47:33 -0500
From: "Michael Figart II" <michaelfigart@yahoo.com>
Subject: [Tango-L] tango to the blues
To: "Tango-L" <tango-l@mit.edu>
Trini wrote;
>In the past couple of months, there has been an interest in
>the tango community of dancing tango to blues music (at
>blues events). There seems to be a new blues scene
>emerging here (or at least being better publicized). I
>understand that jazzy blues would be the appropriate music
>to use. Any such crossovers in other cities?
I love dancing tango to good tango dance music, but sadly, there is very
little of that around Houston. For example, this is an excerpt from an
announcement for an event to be held next week; "....will perform DANCE
music of Argentina.... We will feature music composed by Gardel, Padula,
Piazzolla, Villoldo and others......" The band is very talented, but has
no idea what constitutes good music to dance to, which in general
reflects much of the community. To me, musicality is 98% of the dance,
and I don't enjoy trying to put something together to a Piazzola
recording. And dancing to Gardel!! Isn't that illegal in Argentina?
That's one reason that me and my girlfriend go out at least once a week
dancing to the blues. Not "jazzy" blues, but good down-home, gritty,
Texas blues. It's extremely well-suited for tango, and we both enjoy it
immensely, in addition to learning a lot and getting in some good
practice.
I like dancing to alternative music, but I sometimes get irritated with
DJs who choose to play music just because it's different. We hear nice
"world" music, and beat-heavy disco/rap/electronic stuff. Give me some
music with some meat in it, some feeling, something to interpret into a
dance. I know many may not like blues as I do, but there is still plenty
of good rock, pop, even country, out there that is great for tango.
Looking forward to the "Tango Blues Cruise" in St Louis next month, en
route to Mt Vernon, Missouri for the third annual "Meet in the Middle"
Tango Festival presented by the incomparable Karen Whitesell!
Regards,
Michael Figart II
Date: Thu, 13 Jul 2006 13:13:21 -0700 (PDT)
From: steve pastor <tang0man2005@yahoo.com>
Subject: [Tango-L] tango to the blues
To: tango-l@mit.edu
>From what I've seen of "blues dancing" (which I think should be spelled out rather than
referred to as simply "blues") I think I'll pass. (And it was "competition" footage.) I've
seen people dance to blues for years, and it seems to me like the old "Hey, pay me
money and do what I tell you to do, and you'll be doing ________ (fill in the blank with
the dance name I just made up.)
Wikipedia states that West Coast Swing was orginally danced to "16 note
blues" (sic). (Just kidding alert!) Maybe tango was, too. (End of just kidding alert)
(Anyone having knowledge of what music WCS was danced to originally, please
contact me.)
Want to dance tango to blues? Want to add ganchos and boleos to your West Coast
Swing? Want to do some "crossed feet" or sacadas in your Night Club Two Step?
Want to dance milonga to a really fast country western two step (There's a good one,
Michael! )? It's all good.
Then there's the real thing. Hopefully, we won't forget.
Trini wrote;
>In the past couple of months, there has been an interest in
>the tango community of dancing tango to blues music (at
>blues events). There seems to be a new blues scene
>emerging here (or at least being better publicized). I
>understand that jazzy blues would be the appropriate music
>to use. Any such crossovers in other cities?
I love dancing tango to good tango dance music, but sadly, there is very
little of that around Houston. For example, this is an excerpt from an
announcement for an event to be held next week; "....will perform DANCE
music of Argentina.... We will feature music composed by Gardel, Padula,
Piazzolla, Villoldo and others......" The band is very talented, but has
no idea what constitutes good music to dance to, which in general
reflects much of the community. To me, musicality is 98% of the dance,
and I don't enjoy trying to put something together to a Piazzola
recording. And dancing to Gardel!! Isn't that illegal in Argentina?
That's one reason that me and my girlfriend go out at least once a week
dancing to the blues. Not "jazzy" blues, but good down-home, gritty,
Texas blues. It's extremely well-suited for tango, and we both enjoy it
immensely, in addition to learning a lot and getting in some good
practice.
I like dancing to alternative music, but I sometimes get irritated with
DJs who choose to play music just because it's different. We hear nice
"world" music, and beat-heavy disco/rap/electronic stuff. Give me some
music with some meat in it, some feeling, something to interpret into a
dance. I know many may not like blues as I do, but there is still plenty
of good rock, pop, even country, out there that is great for tango.
Looking forward to the "Tango Blues Cruise" in St Louis next month, en
route to Mt Vernon, Missouri for the third annual "Meet in the Middle"
Tango Festival presented by the incomparable Karen Whitesell!
Regards,
Michael Figart II
Date: Thu, 13 Jul 2006 16:27:20 -0400
From: "Caroline Polack" <runcarolinerun@hotmail.com>
Subject: [Tango-L] tango to the blues
To: tango-l@mit.edu
If tango is about mood, then I don't see how far off the blues are from
tango music.
A friend of mine thinks tango could also be danced to Indian music - more
specifically, Lata's music. If there's 8 beats or 16 half beats, why not?
Methinks there should be a new term - tango fundamentalists.
Tango has gone through a long evolution - why should it stop evolving now?
Where did we draw the line and say ok, on this day, month, year, tango must
no longer change. And who dictated that?
Caroline
Date: Thu, 13 Jul 2006 16:27:20 -0400
From: "Caroline Polack" <runcarolinerun@hotmail.com>
Subject: [Tango-L] tango to the blues
To: tango-l@mit.edu
If tango is about mood, then I don't see how far off the blues are from
tango music.
A friend of mine thinks tango could also be danced to Indian music - more
specifically, Lata's music. If there's 8 beats or 16 half beats, why not?
Methinks there should be a new term - tango fundamentalists.
Tango has gone through a long evolution - why should it stop evolving now?
Where did we draw the line and say ok, on this day, month, year, tango must
no longer change. And who dictated that?
Caroline
Date: Thu, 13 Jul 2006 17:26:00 -0400
From: <tuan35@cox.net>
Subject: Re: [Tango-L] tango to the blues
To: michaelfigart@yahoo.com, Tango-L <tango-l@mit.edu>
<25673915.1152825960250.JavaMail.root@eastrmwml04.mgt.cox.net>
I know what you mean, Michael.
Some people dance West Coast Swing to the Blues and it may fit because it's down and dirty but the slick affectations betray the home grown spirit of the music.
Some people slow dance to the Blues. It is also referred to as dirty dancing or one-step. To me, Tango is the ultimate one-step. No patterns, all improvised, just musicality and feeling. The bending of a note on the harp, guitar or sax can be just as piercing as a held note on the bandoneon. Now that's meaty stuff.
---- Michael Figart II <michaelfigart@yahoo.com> wrote:
> Trini wrote;
> >In the past couple of months, there has been an interest in
> >the tango community of dancing tango to blues music (at
> >blues events). There seems to be a new blues scene
> >emerging here (or at least being better publicized). I
> >understand that jazzy blues would be the appropriate music
> >to use. Any such crossovers in other cities?
>
> I love dancing tango to good tango dance music, but sadly, there is very
> little of that around Houston. For example, this is an excerpt from an
> announcement for an event to be held next week; "....will perform DANCE
> music of Argentina.... We will feature music composed by Gardel, Padula,
> Piazzolla, Villoldo and others......" The band is very talented, but has
> no idea what constitutes good music to dance to, which in general
> reflects much of the community. To me, musicality is 98% of the dance,
> and I don't enjoy trying to put something together to a Piazzola
> recording. And dancing to Gardel!! Isn't that illegal in Argentina?
>
> That's one reason that me and my girlfriend go out at least once a week
> dancing to the blues. Not "jazzy" blues, but good down-home, gritty,
> Texas blues. It's extremely well-suited for tango, and we both enjoy it
> immensely, in addition to learning a lot and getting in some good
> practice.
>
> I like dancing to alternative music, but I sometimes get irritated with
> DJs who choose to play music just because it's different. We hear nice
> "world" music, and beat-heavy disco/rap/electronic stuff. Give me some
> music with some meat in it, some feeling, something to interpret into a
> dance. I know many may not like blues as I do, but there is still plenty
> of good rock, pop, even country, out there that is great for tango.
>
> Looking forward to the "Tango Blues Cruise" in St Louis next month, en
> route to Mt Vernon, Missouri for the third annual "Meet in the Middle"
> Tango Festival presented by the incomparable Karen Whitesell!
>
> Regards,
>
> Michael Figart II
>
>
>
>
Date: Thu, 13 Jul 2006 14:43:27 -0700 (PDT)
From: "Trini y Sean \(PATangoS\)" <patangos@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Tango-L] tango to the blues
Hi Michael,
Any recommendations of gritty Texas blues bands?
Having not visited the local blues dancing scene, I don't
know exactly what jazzy blues is. I do know that the
tangueros did not like jump blues for tango.
Trini
--- Michael Figart II <michaelfigart@yahoo.com> wrote:
> That's one reason that me and my girlfriend go out at
> least once a week
> dancing to the blues. Not "jazzy" blues, but good
> down-home, gritty,
> Texas blues. It's extremely well-suited for tango, and we
> both enjoy it
> immensely, in addition to learning a lot and getting in
> some good
> practice.
>
Date: Thu, 13 Jul 2006 15:55:55 -0600
From: "Bruno Romero" <romerob@telusplanet.net>
Subject: [Tango-L] tango to the blues
To: <tango-l@mit.edu>
Caroline Polack wrote
>Tango has gone through a long evolution - why should it stop evolving now?
Where did we draw the line and say ok, on this day, month, year, tango must
no longer change. And who dictated that? <
My 2 cents:
Who dictated that?
The musicians and dancers based on the time and social medium they were in.
In other words, the style of tango music becomes fashionable. This would
have an effect on the style of dancing. Tango x 2 presented tango style from
1940's may be more for stage, but still with noticeable changes in the tango
choreography.
Is easy to track down the evolution of tango music particularly from the
late 1930's to early 1940's. The transition in tango music was from
rhythmical to lyricism (romantic emotion). A great of exponent of rhythmical
tango music among many others was the musical director and pianist Francisco
Lomuto a.k.a Pancho Laguna, and of lyricism (romantic emotion) among many
others was the violin player and also musical director Elvino Vardaro.
* Francisco Lomuto composed close to 1000 records among tangos, jazz,
milongas, candombe, rumbas, paso dobles, etc. However only very few cd's are
commercially available. Francisco's candombes and milongas have more bite
than other composers' music.
Date: Thu, 13 Jul 2006 15:41:44 -0700 (PDT)
From: steve pastor <tang0man2005@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Tango-L] tango to the blues
To: "Trini y Sean \(PATangoS\)" <patangos@yahoo.com>, Tango-L
Trini:
I know you didn't ask me, and it's not Texas blues (strictly speaking), but you might
go to this url
https://www.cmt.com/artists/az/anderson_keith/videos.jhtml
and click on the link for "Pickin' WIldflowers". It's "country", but it's blues.
Close your eyes and think about doing tango.
I think the dancing in the video is pretty cool, too.
(I only needed the thinnest of excuses to post this!)
"Trini y Sean (PATangoS)" <patangos@yahoo.com> wrote:
Hi Michael,
Any recommendations of gritty Texas blues bands?
Having not visited the local blues dancing scene, I don't
know exactly what jazzy blues is. I do know that the
tangueros did not like jump blues for tango.
Trini
--- Michael Figart II wrote:
> That's one reason that me and my girlfriend go out at
> least once a week
> dancing to the blues. Not "jazzy" blues, but good
> down-home, gritty,
> Texas blues. It's extremely well-suited for tango, and we
> both enjoy it
> immensely, in addition to learning a lot and getting in
> some good
> practice.
>
Date: Thu, 13 Jul 2006 19:12:34 -0500
From: "Lois Donnay" <donnay@donnay.net>
Subject: Re: [Tango-L] tango to the blues
To: "'Tango-L'" <tango-l@mit.edu>
Once every two months or so, I teach a seminar on "Tango to the Blues".
There are a few in this community who are struck with the way you can
interpret a great blues song with tango. Blues and tango music share a
common history, I think. The way a blues musician bends the notes is similar
enough to my ears to the bandoneon. Anyway, I dance tango to the blues at
least twice a week. We have a great blues scene here in Mpls. Keep in mind
that I am quite fussy as to the music I dance tango to, mostly because I
know enough other dances that I prefer doing the appropriate dance to the
appropriate music.
"Swango" I believe is West Coast Swing and Tango. That's what Daniel Trenner
used to teach, anyway. West Coast Swing is also danced to blues (along with
other genres). Ther is also Blues Dancing, which I do as well.
Hope some of you are considering a visit to Mpls for the Heartland Tango
Festival in September!
Lois
Minneapolis, MN 55408
www.mndance.com
>
> Trini wrote;
> >In the past couple of months, there has been an interest in
> the tango
> >community of dancing tango to blues music (at blues events). There
> >seems to be a new blues scene emerging here (or at least
> being better
> >publicized). I understand that jazzy blues would be the appropriate
> >music to use. Any such crossovers in other cities?
>
> I love dancing tango to good tango dance music, but sadly,
> there is very little of that around Houston. For example,
> this is an excerpt from an announcement for an event to be
> held next week; "....will perform DANCE music of
> Argentina.... We will feature music composed by Gardel,
> Padula, Piazzolla, Villoldo and others......" The band is
> very talented, but has no idea what constitutes good music to
> dance to, which in general reflects much of the community. To
> me, musicality is 98% of the dance, and I don't enjoy trying
> to put something together to a Piazzola recording. And
> dancing to Gardel!! Isn't that illegal in Argentina?
>
> That's one reason that me and my girlfriend go out at least
> once a week dancing to the blues. Not "jazzy" blues, but good
> down-home, gritty, Texas blues. It's extremely well-suited
> for tango, and we both enjoy it immensely, in addition to
> learning a lot and getting in some good practice.
>
> I like dancing to alternative music, but I sometimes get
> irritated with DJs who choose to play music just because it's
> different. We hear nice "world" music, and beat-heavy
> disco/rap/electronic stuff. Give me some music with some meat
> in it, some feeling, something to interpret into a dance. I
> know many may not like blues as I do, but there is still
> plenty of good rock, pop, even country, out there that is
> great for tango.
>
> Looking forward to the "Tango Blues Cruise" in St Louis next
> month, en route to Mt Vernon, Missouri for the third annual
> "Meet in the Middle" Tango Festival presented by the
> incomparable Karen Whitesell!
>
> Regards,
>
> Michael Figart II
>
Date: Fri, 14 Jul 2006 00:29:20 -0400
From: tanguerochino@netscape.net
Subject: Re: [Tango-L] tango to the blues
To: tango-l@mit.edu
-----Original Message-----
Lois Donnay wrote:
>... Blues and tango music share a common history...
A while back, I came home after a milonga, and turned on the TV while I
was having a snack. The program was a documentary on the evolution of
jazz music, and the topic that night was blues. A the program went on
to describe how the musical genre came to be, I felt an instant
recognition. It is the music of the working class, of the poor. The
songs, the lyrics, are all about the hardship of everyday life. One
comment from a musician struck me. He said the people who sing the
blues are really the happy ones. Blues is an outlet to let go of their
daily frustrations of life. They sing about the hardship so they can
forget about it, much like tango.
Another thing that caught my attention was a segment on parties. There
may have been a name for these, but I don't recall right now. They
were talking about the deep south here - Luisiana, Alabama. Because of
the heat, they have dances that would start late at night. The (blues)
musicians would play and people would come and dance. The music is
soulful, and sultry. The dancing and slow, and sweaty. But everyone
would hang around, until dawn wakes them from their trance and send
them home for some sleep.
Sound familiar, doesn't it?
Date: Fri, 14 Jul 2006 14:21:23 -0500
From: "Michael Figart II" <michaelfigart@yahoo.com>
Subject: [Tango-L] tango to the blues
To: "Tango-L" <tango-l@mit.edu>
Hello Trini,
In response to your question "Any recommendations of gritty Texas blues
bands?"
I probably should have said "southern blues"....I just love good blues,
no matter where it's from, but the tradition has its home in the south.
B B King, Robert Johnson, Muddy Waters, Albert King (Mississippi), Ray
Charles (Georgia), Buddy Guy (Louisiana), Freddy King, Johnny Winter,
Stevie Ray Vaughn, T-Bone Walker (Texas). All of these guys have a lot
of stuff that's great for tango, sometimes maybe not the original
recording, but their stuff has been recycled many times by many artists.
Not all good blues works, sometimes it's too slow, or too fast, but if
the bpm is right, it's got a feel that no other music has, that can
provide lots of opportunity for interpretation/expression.
Much of the time I go dancing, it's just jam sessions where artists
change all the time. Texas seems to be the breeding ground the last few
years (probably due to the huge Austin music sing and the Kerrville folk
festival), of some of the best newer blues bands. Last weekend danced to
Mark May www.markmay.com . I also like Carolyn Wonderland
www.carolynwonderland.com , Hadden Sayers Band www.haddensayers.com ,
Delbert McClinton www.delbertmcclinton.com , Chris Duarte......and many
more (all the previous guys are from Texas). Tab Benoit from Louisiana.
Jonny Lang from N Dakota. Colin James from Canada.
But it doesn't "have" to be strict blues...I like Tracy Chapman ("You're
the One"), Sarah McLachlan, Lucinda Williams, Norah Jones, Sting, Karen
Savoca, Cindy Kalmenson, Boz Scaggs, Bob Seger... folky country rock/pop
influenced by the blues....
Regards to all,
Michael
Ps to Steve Pastor---Hey, I like that Keith Anderson!
Date: Mon, 17 Jul 2006 15:36:53 -0700 (PDT)
From: steve pastor <tang0man2005@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Tango-L] tango to the blues
To: tuan35@cox.net, michaelfigart@yahoo.com, Tango-L <tango-l@mit.edu>
Moving the same way to music, no matter what the music does, or doing things that
are not in the music is.... symptomatic of a lack of musicality whether it's Tango, West Coast Swing, or two step.
I listened to "Big Mama" Thornton's "Hound Dog" this weekend. You don't HAVE to do
WCS with slick affections, just like you don't HAVE to do boleos and ganchos when
you dance Argentine Tango.
And it turns out that the original "Hound Dog" (a "Jump Blues") probably WAS used
for WCS type dancing back then.
P.S. I don't particularly care for ballroom styling at a country western place, either.
tuan35@cox.net wrote:
I know what you mean, Michael.
Some people dance West Coast Swing to the Blues and it may fit because it's down and dirty but the slick affectations betray the home grown spirit of the music.
Some people slow dance to the Blues. It is also referred to as dirty dancing or one-step. To me, Tango is the ultimate one-step. No patterns, all improvised, just musicality and feeling. The bending of a note on the harp, guitar or sax can be just as piercing as a held note on the bandoneon. Now that's meaty stuff.
---- Michael Figart II wrote:
> Trini wrote;
> >In the past couple of months, there has been an interest in
> >the tango community of dancing tango to blues music (at
> >blues events). There seems to be a new blues scene
> >emerging here (or at least being better publicized). I
> >understand that jazzy blues would be the appropriate music
> >to use. Any such crossovers in other cities?
>
> I love dancing tango to good tango dance music, but sadly, there is very
> little of that around Houston. For example, this is an excerpt from an
> announcement for an event to be held next week; "....will perform DANCE
> music of Argentina.... We will feature music composed by Gardel, Padula,
> Piazzolla, Villoldo and others......" The band is very talented, but has
> no idea what constitutes good music to dance to, which in general
> reflects much of the community. To me, musicality is 98% of the dance,
> and I don't enjoy trying to put something together to a Piazzola
> recording. And dancing to Gardel!! Isn't that illegal in Argentina?
>
> That's one reason that me and my girlfriend go out at least once a week
> dancing to the blues. Not "jazzy" blues, but good down-home, gritty,
> Texas blues. It's extremely well-suited for tango, and we both enjoy it
> immensely, in addition to learning a lot and getting in some good
> practice.
>
> I like dancing to alternative music, but I sometimes get irritated with
> DJs who choose to play music just because it's different. We hear nice
> "world" music, and beat-heavy disco/rap/electronic stuff. Give me some
> music with some meat in it, some feeling, something to interpret into a
> dance. I know many may not like blues as I do, but there is still plenty
> of good rock, pop, even country, out there that is great for tango.
>
> Looking forward to the "Tango Blues Cruise" in St Louis next month, en
> route to Mt Vernon, Missouri for the third annual "Meet in the Middle"
> Tango Festival presented by the incomparable Karen Whitesell!
>
> Regards,
>
> Michael Figart II
>
>
>
>
Date: Fri, 21 Jul 2006 16:52:59 -0700 (PDT)
From: steve pastor <tang0man2005@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Tango-L] tango to the blues (and ragtime )
To: Tango-L <tango-l@mit.edu>
Last week I wrote jokingly that maybe blues had influenced tango. The truth is not so
far away.
While researching the beginnings of West Coast Swing I came across the following.
Jelly Roll "Morton was also adept at using the habanera rhythm (his "jazz tangos")
like"Mamanita", "Creepy Feeling", and the tango blues "New Orleans Joys" - or "New
Orleans Blues" - are fine examples), which in jazz soon became the Charleston rhythm."
Also, in writing about Ragtime, which "began to be published in the 1890s", "an Afro-
American version of the polka" , "almost immediately became a kind of national, even
worldwide craze". If you listen to TodoTango, you have probably heard tangos and
thought (if you are familiar with ragtime), "Hey, that sounds like a ragtime!"
I have heard tangos that were definitely jazz like.
Does anyone know of any tangos that sound bluesy, or that "swing"?
quotes from The revised edition of "The Smithsonian Collection of Classic Jazz" 1987
Yahoo! Messenger with Voice. Make PC-to-Phone Calls to the US (and 30+ countries) for 2?/min or less.
Date: Fri, 21 Jul 2006 18:50:12 -0600
From: "Bruno Romero" <romerob@telusplanet.net>
Subject: Re: [Tango-L] tango to the blues (and ragtime )
To: <tango-l@mit.edu>
Steve pastor wrote:
> I have heard tangos that were definitely jazz like.
Does anyone know of any tangos that sound bluesy, or that "swing"?<
My 2 cents:
On the swing influence,
Tango with swing influence may be found in Anibal Troilo's orchestra early
recordings, when the pianist Orlando Go?i and the contrabass player Kicho
Diaz joined the Anibal's orchestra.
Early recordings: Tinta verde (1938), Comme Il Faut (1938), Cachirulo
(1941), De Pura Cepa(1941), El Tamango (1941), C.T.V. (1941), etc.
Jazz influence:
Orlando Go?i played with an internal swing possibly influenced by
contemporary pianists such as Teddy Wilson.
Orlando Go?i, had force of attack in the execution (hit and swing).
In other words, voluptous sound, wavy, romantic, round and equal.
Kicho Diaz, inherited *Leopoldo Thompson's style of playing the contrabass
with the canyengue effect. The contrabass or group of bandoneons use the
sweep (arrastre) predominant of the orchestras with "swing tanguero".
*Leopoldo Thompson played for Julio de Caro's, Francisco Canaro's , and
Eduardo Arolas' orchestras
Cheers,
Bruno
