4863  Attending a lesson above your dancing skills

Date: Tue, 27 Mar 2007 17:00:11 +0000
From: "Sergio Vandekier" <sergiovandekier990@hotmail.com>
Subject: [Tango-L] Attending a lesson above your dancing skills
To: tango-l@mit.edu

It was said

" Hi Trini, I wasn't referring to Chris' recent message, but his email dated
2 October 2006
and reprinted below.

Subject: Re: [Tango-L] Discussion Topics

Date: Tue, 27 Mar 2007 11:58:55 -0800
From: "Igor Polk" <ipolk@virtuar.com>
Subject: [Tango-L] Attending a lesson above your dancing skills
To: <tango-l@mit.edu>

Sergio wrote:

"This is a typical example of a lesson programmed for advanced dancers which
is filled with students of lower skill levels.

When faced with this situation one can

1) adjust the teaching to a lower level. The advanced students are
shortchanged.

2) Give an advanced lesson as scheduled. Most students can not follow.

3) Remind everybody that the lesson is for advanced students and ask those
that do not belong there to leave before the lesson starts. Many people and
the organizers get upset.


Igor now:

There is 4th possibility which I know great teachers can do:

4) They grasp the average level of class in a minute. Then they introduce
enough simple, to the average level of the class, and advanced material so
that everyone gets his share of participation and new knowledge and skills.
I have noticed there are several ways to do it. After the lesson there is a
festive sense of achievement and excitement. I would say these lessons are
remembered for life!

In fact, any lesson of great teachers is like that.

Igor Polk
PS. I am not saying that less advanced teachers are useless. No, their work
and dedication should be very appreciated since they are those who bring
fresh people to tango, organize tango things for us with their energy and
time. Teaching is an art itself and not everyone is born with the same
talent which is rare, but great teachers could not do anything without
everyone else - we are all community.

Date: Tue, 27 Mar 2007 14:15:02 -0600
From: Nina Pesochinsky <nina@earthnet.net>
Subject: Re: [Tango-L] Attending a lesson above your dancing skills
To: tango-l@mit.edu
format="flowed"

Hello, Dancers,

Not only do the teachers have to know how to teach, meaning speak many
different "languages" of sharing the dance, but the students have to
know how to take a dance class.

I find this to be one of the biggest deficiencies of social dance
students - they do not know how to "take" a dance class.

So what does it mean knowing how to "take" a dance class? In the
bigger world of dance, such as modern and classical dance, it means
several things. First, the dancer must know how to apply
himself/herself to the learning process. How to listen to the teacher
and how to "take" what the teacher has to offer, whether or not the
teacher is presenting it, is a part of this process. Observation and
reflection are esssential. In other words, the students need to know
how to recognize what the teacher has and take it, either by
listening, interpreting, immitating, etc., and not wait for it to be
offered to them or installed into them while they remain passive.

Another aspect of knowing how to "take" a dance class is not to trip
over one's own body. Social dancers often accomplish this by simply
putting themselves into the movement without thought or analysis. The
problems arise when dancers of lesser skill than the class decide that
they need to "understand" the movement before they attempt to do it.

If dancers of lower levels know how to "take" a dance class, they will
not slow down the class and they will learn a lot. This type of
dancers MUST take higher level classes. If they take classes of their
own level, they will forever remain at that level.

That said, those dancers who do not have the skill of knowing how to
take a dance class and who wait for the teacher to install the
material into them, who are passive about their own learning, may not
benefit as readily from higher level classes.

My very best regards to all,

Nina




Quoting Igor Polk <ipolk@virtuar.com>:

> Sergio wrote:
>
> "This is a typical example of a lesson programmed for advanced dancers which
> is filled with students of lower skill levels.
>
> When faced with this situation one can
>
> 1) adjust the teaching to a lower level. The advanced students are
> shortchanged.
>
> 2) Give an advanced lesson as scheduled. Most students can not follow.
>
> 3) Remind everybody that the lesson is for advanced students and ask those
> that do not belong there to leave before the lesson starts. Many people and
> the organizers get upset.
>
>
> Igor now:
>
> There is 4th possibility which I know great teachers can do:
>
> 4) They grasp the average level of class in a minute. Then they introduce
> enough simple, to the average level of the class, and advanced material so
> that everyone gets his share of participation and new knowledge and skills.
> I have noticed there are several ways to do it. After the lesson there is a
> festive sense of achievement and excitement. I would say these lessons are
> remembered for life!
>
> In fact, any lesson of great teachers is like that.
>
> Igor Polk
> PS. I am not saying that less advanced teachers are useless. No, their work
> and dedication should be very appreciated since they are those who bring
> fresh people to tango, organize tango things for us with their energy and
> time. Teaching is an art itself and not everyone is born with the same
> talent which is rare, but great teachers could not do anything without
> everyone else - we are all community.
>
>
>

Date: Tue, 27 Mar 2007 18:00:10 -0400
From: "Caroline Polack" <runcarolinerun@hotmail.com>
Subject: [Tango-L] Attending a lesson above your dancing skills
To: tango-l@mit.edu

"That said, those dancers who do not have the skill of knowing how to
take a dance class and who wait for the teacher to install the
material into them, who are passive about their own learning, may not
benefit as readily from higher level classes."

Exactly! Thanks Nina - students are as accountable as teachers for their own
learning. In my advanced class, there are some leaders who still haven't got
a clue as to how to walk, lead crosses or turn on the spot without falling
over. They are the ones I try hardest to avoid doing exercises with because
they clearly don't care enough to practice what they learn.

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Date: Tue, 27 Mar 2007 21:17:56 -0400
From: "Michael" <tangomaniac@cavtel.net>
Subject: Re: [Tango-L] Attending a lesson above your dancing skills
To: "Nina Pesochinsky" <nina@earthnet.net>, <tango-l@mit.edu>
Cc: Michael <tangomaniac@cavtel.net>

Nina Pesochinsky nina@earthnet.net wrote
Subject: Re: [Tango-L] Attending a lesson above your dancing skills

Date: Tue, 27 Mar 2007 21:17:56 -0400
From: "Michael" <tangomaniac@cavtel.net>
Subject: Re: [Tango-L] Attending a lesson above your dancing skills
To: "Nina Pesochinsky" <nina@earthnet.net>, <tango-l@mit.edu>
Cc: Michael <tangomaniac@cavtel.net>

Nina Pesochinsky nina@earthnet.net wrote
Subject: Re: [Tango-L] Attending a lesson above your dancing skills


Hello, Dancers,

Not only do the teachers have to know how to teach, meaning speak many
different "languages" of sharing the dance, but the students have to
know how to take a dance class.

I find this to be one of the biggest deficiencies of social dance
students - they do not know how to "take" a dance class.
I came across this quote (without verifying its authenticity):

"It is impossible for a man to learn what he thinks he already knows."
-- Epictetus

I'll leave it to the list to determine if it's applicable.

Michael
Washington, DC
Flying Thursday to the Atlanta Tango Festival

Date: Tue, 27 Mar 2007 22:38:16 -0400
From: Keith <keith@tangohk.com>
Subject: Re: [Tango-L] Attending a lesson above your dancing skills
To: tango-l@mit.edu

Sergio wrote:

>This is a typical example of a lesson programmed for advanced dancers which
>is filled with students of lower skill levels.
>
>When faced with this situation one can
>
>1) adjust the teaching to a lower level. The advanced students are
>shortchanged.
>
>2) Give an advanced lesson as scheduled. Most students can not follow.
>
>3) Remind everybody that the lesson is for advanced students and ask those
>that do not belong there to leave before the lesson starts. Many people and
>the organizers get upset.
>
>Sergio

Those are the teacher's options. The student can also decide to:

1. Realise he made a mistake and leave the class [I've done this at a
Raul Bravo class].

2. Realise he made a mistake, but do the best he can without disturbing the
more advanced students [I've done this at a Gustavo Naveira class].

3. Accept no responsibility and just blame the teacher.

Seems Chris chose to do the latter.

Keith, HK