1263  ***The confession***

Date: Sat, 10 May 2003 15:13:37 -0400
From: Sergio <cachafaz@ADELPHIA.NET>
Subject: ***The confession***

I do not have any agenda other than clarify this matter once and for ever.
The main reason being a repulsion I feel for the villainous tactics that
were used to attack a person, guilty or not, and in the process to decrease
the prestige that most tango teachers enjoy.

Carlos Lima writes:

"OK, things are looking up. After weeks of stultifying boredom, we now have
been told by a Portenno that another Portenno's Spanish is the result of
passing a third Portenno's English through BabelFish. Well the third
Portenno
is my own embellishment. I am entitled to one myself, right? So the Tango-L
is right back on track."

"If I were keen on finding a compensation for all the bad, it would be a
more
serious one. Say, a good part of what is written on tango, I venture to say
most of what is written, here too, is myth. Tango and myth are inseparable."

This paragraphs are confusing and dark. This is a characteristic of Baroque
writers.
They compose in a convoluted way, it is necessary to be conversant with
Spanish/Portuguese Literature of the Middle Ages to understand the meaning.

My translation into modern English:

"We have been told by a Portenno" -This is a reference to me, I said in one
note that a computer translator was used to produce the Spanish/Italian
version of the letters.-

"That another Portenno's Spanish is the result of passing a third portenno's
English through Babelfish."
-Here he refers to my saying that "El Pibe" letters were originally written
in English and then translated into Spanish/Italian either by an Italian
mixing both languages with multiple errors or by using a computer translator
or both.
He calls the computer translator "BabelFish", a biblical reference, men were
building a Tower in Babel to reach Paradise, God prevented this from
occurring by confusing their languages.

Now the *confession : "Well the third Portenno
is my own embellishment. I am entitled to one myself, right? So the Tango-L
is right back on track."

The third Portenno is the one that used the computer to translate into
Spanish/Italian the English version of the letters.
I never said that this one was a Portenno, I said "Somebody" used a
computer.
He acknowledges that this somebody is nobody else than *HIMSELF. He calls
the use of the computer HIS own embellishment. He states that he is entitled
to do so."so the Tango-L is right back on track."

Then he adds: "If I were keen on finding a compensation for all the bad, it
would be a more
serious one. Say, a good part of what is written on tango, I venture to say
most of what is written, here too, is myth. Tango and myth are inseparable."

Here he admits that he did it for vengeance, he says that the Damage he
inflicted on his victim is nothing compared to what he deserved. This
compensation that he is claiming to have right to -in his own words "would
be a more serious one".

Then he goes back to his old story of asserting that tango and myth are
inseparable.

Is he here saying that the whole thing is Myth? that the letters never
existed. That they were the creation of him and his friend?
This is a possibility . I am told by New Yorkers that the story is true,
that "El Pibe" hurt several people in the New York tango scene. The story
may be true but are the letters genuine or they are an invention to obtain
compensation.

Let's accept for the sake of discussion that "El Pibe" hurt emotionally or
economically several people in New York.
Those people have a right to moral, emotional or economical, compensation NO
DOUBT. We do not argue with that fact.

What a normal person could do?
1-Write a note in the Internet Warning People, that so and so is a bad tango
teacher, he is unethical, please never give him a deal, he will cheat,
destroy, sadden, dirty anything that he touches,etc,etc.
2- Go to court.
3- Many other elegant ways, that I know would prevent him from ever
getting another job in this country or elsewhere.

What I find objectionable is to try to get compensation by publishing some
confusing letters.
Letters that are not clear at as to the nature of the offense. Letters that
seem to be a fabrication of an equally confused mind.
AND...use the occasion to attack all Argentinean Tango Teachers. :))) How
absurd can you be?

We know that there are all kind of people out there to take advantage of us.
So if you are a beautiful, young lady, with a good bank account and allow
men (tangueros or whatever their occupation may be) to take advantage of you
again and again, I am sorry but you should have therapy to uncover the
secret motivation you have to be victimized that way. The same thing happens
to good looking or not, young or not, but that yes have a good bank account
men. They frequently allow women to take advantage of them, then they
complain about the human race and generalize. Wrong on both sides.

I hope that this teaches something useful to all of us. Be it Tango or Life.
Perhaps both.

Date: Sun, 11 May 2003 00:43:52 -0400
From: Dirk J Bakker <dbakker@MINDSPRING.COM>
Subject: Re: ***The confession***

Sergio,

You write: "I do not have any agenda other than clarify ..."

"He calls the computer translator "BabelFish", a biblical reference, men
were
building a Tower in Babel to reach Paradise, God prevented this from
occurring by confusing their languages."

Huh? FYI:

BabelFish IS, factually, the name of the online translation service
maintained by AltaVista.

https://babelfish.altavista.com/

And it is not at all difficult to determine this, IF one takes the time
to do a simple Google search.

So it would seem most unlikely that Mr. Lima would, in the Baroque style
you accuse him of practicing, have created such an allusion.

> This [sic] paragraphs are confusing and dark. This is a characteristic
> of Baroque
> writers.
> They compose in a convoluted way, it is necessary to be conversant with
> Spanish/Portuguese Literature of the Middle Ages to understand the
> meaning.
>

Nonsense.

His comments are, at least to me, a simple english parody of this
theatre. And it stands to reason that any other such ackward
(mechanical) translation would, if used literally, accomplish the same.

Me thinks that, on the contrary, he is VERY correct, and astute, that
out of sheer BOREDOM (i.e. nothing better to do), this silly thread has
been given the currency, it does not deserve. Why would the moderator of
this list otherwise announce the original postings be deleted from the
archive were they not On Topic and inappropriate? But perhaps I speak
out of turn having recently subscribed to this list for the purpose of
establishing contacts within musicians of Tango, and indeed this 'Petty
Peyton Place' of yours is On Topic for this list or for your purposes.

> My translation into modern English:
>

Oh, please. Me thinks that you presume to know english better than you
really do. Else, you have a paranoid imagination.

> I hope that this teaches something useful to all of us.

I'd settle to find how you say "Don't feed the Trolls" in spanish. Hint:
you need to understand the sense of the expression first.


Perhaps it is difficult to see true colors unless one takes the colored
glasses off one's face. N'est ce pas?

Cheers.