2375 leading the cross, respecting LOD, and zining out.... etc.
Date: Fri, 9 Apr 2004 21:32:27 -0400
From: WHITE 95 R <white95r@HOTMAIL.COM>
Subject: leading the cross, respecting LOD, and zining out.... etc.
I've watched with some interest the ongoing discussions about the LOD,
leading the cross and even that old "tangasm", or "dancing in the zone". As
some call it now. I guess it's time once again to remind the regulars and
instruct the newbies about tango.
All agree that the LOD should be respected. Some even say that one should
never pass anyone else or God forbid, take a back step..... Well, the LOD is
the way to dance, but it's so dependent on every dancer on the floor that it
cannot be a uniform or constant thing. One must continually adjust and
navigate around the floor compensating for the idiosincracies and skills of
the other dancers. There is no traffic cop on the pista, no marked lanes, no
speed signs or traffic signs of any kind. It's up to each and every dancer
to make the dance enjoyable for the leader and his partner. It's a poor cop
out and excuse to blame other dancers (with certain notable exceptions) for
one's own lack of skill. Remember, there is no separate "navigation"
technique or classes. The dance "is" the navigation.
The famous lead to the cross is another argument that can be easily and
finally settled. As many teachers have explained, Alberto Paz perhaps most
clearly, there is actually a code of the dance of tango. The basic code of
tango is that the woman turns around the man in a grapevine type of step. In
other words it's the sequence known as the molinete, and the man dances
arouind the floor (following the LOD). Of course, the man can also turn
around the woman and both turn around each other while dancing turns.
Generally this requires a good bit of skill so it's not commonly done by
all.
It's probably already known but just for clarity, the turn of the woman
around the man can begin with any one of the molinete steps, for example a
side step or either the front or back cross. Since basically, the woman
dances around the man and the man dances around the floor, the molinete gets
elongated as it were. Thusly the 8 count basic was developed. The salida is
a side step to the woman's right but since the man is moving, the back cross
becomes a step straight back, the leader keeps moving so the follower's next
"side" step also goes straight back, next comes the front cross, and you
guessed it, since the man is still moving forward the woman steps straight
back again, but the code requires a front cross, so she crosses her left
foot in front of the right and takes a step. Thus the cross is led. There is
no magic, no mistery, nor some special "lead". It is the inevitable
consequence of the woman doing the turn to her right as the leader moves
along the line of dance.
Now, should she put her weight on the left foot when she crosses? Of course!
Imagine the man leading a traditional molinete around himself as he stays
stationary and turns to his left... Should the woman suddenly stop the turn
by just posing with her left foot in the air (or barely touching the floor)
at the 4th step from the salida? Of course not, the woman would continue to
follow the code and continue her molinete until the man leads something
else. Why should the front cross ever be performad differently? The front
cross is led because its a natural progression of the code. If a front cross
is not allowed, it's really something unusual and unexpected. A change of
direction. This is regardless of whether the man is moving along the LOD or
doing a stationary turn.
Now, the famous "zone"... While it's true that one gets "lost" in the dance
and when both dancers are skilled, the music is right, and the crowd is "in
the groove", It's easy and very pleasurable to dance almost effortlessly and
almost "automatically". However, just closing the eyes and affecting some
sort of dreamy expression does not make one a good dancer. I see too many
folks dance with strange affectations, with eyes closed and flapping their
arms like chickens, while impeding the flow along the LOD or running over
other dancers. Lack of skill and manners cannot be hid or disguised with
some silly affectation. Unless the dancers are really good, they should
leave the affectations alone and concentrate in developing the skills needed
to navigate the floor smoothly, elegantly "and" most of all, dancing actual
tango. Yes, if all you can do is plod along with eyes closed stopping often
and blocking the flow, you need to learn more about the tango, take more
lessons, practice, and dance with your eyes open so you can do the simple
salidas, and half turns to the right and left with ocho cortado. learn to do
cortes and how to use the rhythmic music of tango with all the slow and
quick steps needed to dance. Then you can understand how to "navigate" and
respect the LOD, and yes, how to lead and follow the 8 count basic too. Of
course those of you who are great dancers (and a pleasure to watch as to
dance with ;)) please dance with your eyes closed and a blissfull
expression. You've earned it!
Tango education to all,
Manuel
visit our webpage
www.tango-rio.com
Date: Sat, 10 Apr 2004 12:40:30 -0700
From: jackie ling wong <jackie.wong@VERIZON.NET>
Subject: Re: leading the cross, respecting LOD, and zining out.... etc.
this dialogue is very interesting to me because i am surprized at what
people read into the word "zone"...
i don't think people who are flapping their arms like chickens, or running
over people, or impeding the flow of the LOD,
are truly "zoning"..how can you?,...it would feel more like bumper cars...my
best zones are with leaders who are focused on me "the follower"...
i can accommodate various "styles" of dancing from the leader and still
"zone"..maybe the technique is not exact,
(in fact, one of our favorite leaders bends over the follower) but the
attention is on the music and "us"...and that doesn't mean forgetting about
the LOD...because to be focused on the follower, you need to take care that
they don't get hurt...
personally i'm tired of dancing with leaders who are "in" their feet...where
i feel as if i am an ornament...
give me a considerate leader and i'm in heaven...give me a wonderful smooth
walk and i'm in heaven......
because i teach and my vocabulary is large, i'm often asked to dance by
leaders who want to strut their stuff...
i can do all the stuff but those dances are not interesting to me...many
times it's nicer to dance with beginners who have less vocabulary..
jackie
> Now, the famous "zone"... While it's true that one gets "lost" in the
dance
> and when both dancers are skilled, the music is right, and the crowd is
"in
> the groove", It's easy and very pleasurable to dance almost effortlessly
and
> almost "automatically". However, just closing the eyes and affecting some
> sort of dreamy expression does not make one a good dancer. I see too many
> folks dance with strange affectations, with eyes closed and flapping their
> arms like chickens, while impeding the flow along the LOD or running over
> other dancers. Lack of skill and manners cannot be hid or disguised with
> some silly affectation. Unless the dancers are really good, they should
> leave the affectations alone and concentrate in developing the skills
needed
> to navigate the floor smoothly, elegantly "and" most of all, dancing
actual
> tango. Yes, if all you can do is plod along with eyes closed stopping
often
> and blocking the flow, you need to learn more about the tango, take more
> lessons, practice, and dance with your eyes open so you can do the simple
> salidas, and half turns to the right and left with ocho cortado. learn to
do
> cortes and how to use the rhythmic music of tango with all the slow and
> quick steps needed to dance. Then you can understand how to "navigate" and
> respect the LOD, and yes, how to lead and follow the 8 count basic too. Of
> course those of you who are great dancers (and a pleasure to watch as to
> dance with ;)) please dance with your eyes closed and a blissfull
> expression. You've earned it!
>
> Tango education to all,
>
> Manuel
>
>
Date: Sun, 11 Apr 2004 02:29:10 -0500
From: Hector <maselli@GATE.NET>
Subject: Re: leading the cross, respecting LOD, and zining out.... etc.
On Apr 11, 2004, at 2:00 AM, jackie ling wong <jackie.wong@VERIZON.NET> wrote:
>because i teach and my vocabulary is large, i'm often asked to dance by
>leaders who want to strut their stuff...
>i can do all the stuff but those dances are not interesting to me...many
>times it's nicer to dance with beginners who have less vocabulary..
Do you then give them their money back, or you just rip them off and then 'zone' behind their backs?
Hector
Date: Sun, 11 Apr 2004 09:56:22 -0700
From: jackie ling wong <jackie.wong@VERIZON.NET>
Subject: Re: leading the cross, respecting LOD, and zining out.... etc.
"Do you then give them their money back, or you just rip them off and then
'zone' behind their back"
maybe i wasn't clear...when i say strut their stuff, i'm talking about
leaders who are dancing by themselves....where there is no consideration for
the follower...one example is when there is a birthday dance and the
follower is a beginner...you won't believe how many times i have seen
leaders "strut their stuff" and cause the beginner, during their birthday
dance, to trip and stumble and race to keep up with their lead...so i'm not
sure what you mean about "rip them off and zone behind their back".
someone asked me if i lead....i most certainly do...and i love it...
what's interesting is that when i have participated in discussions about
tango and "zoning" comes up, there has never, not once, been a negative
reaction to it...it's surprising to me to receive it now, either on the list
or in personal emails...maybe it's my email communication skills..:-)
www.tangopulse.net
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Sunday, April 11, 2004 12:29 AM
Subject: Re: [TANGO-L] leading the cross, respecting LOD, and zining out....
etc.
> On Apr 11, 2004, at 2:00 AM, jackie ling wong <jackie.wong@VERIZON.NET>
wrote:
>
> >because i teach and my vocabulary is large, i'm often asked to dance by
> >leaders who want to strut their stuff...
> >i can do all the stuff but those dances are not interesting to me...many
> >times it's nicer to dance with beginners who have less vocabulary..
>
> > Do you then give them their money back, or you just rip them off and
then 'zone' behind their backs?
> Hector
>
Date: Sun, 11 Apr 2004 11:18:20 -0700
From: jackie ling wong <jackie.wong@VERIZON.NET>
Subject: Re: leading the cross, respecting LOD, and zining out.... etc.
ahh..spoken from a leader who i recently danced with and it was
lovely...definitely "zone" dances..:-)
jackie
www.tangopulse.net
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Sunday, April 11, 2004 7:26 AM
Subject: Re: [TANGO-L] leading the cross, respecting LOD, and zining out....
etc.
> No, your skills are fine. Some people are plain rude!
>
> jackie ling wong wrote:
>
> >...maybe it's my email communication skills..:-)
> >
> >www.tangopulse.net
> >
> >----- Original Message -----
> >From: "Hector" <maselli@GATE.NET>
> >To: <TANGO-L@MITVMA.MIT.EDU>
> >Sent: Sunday, April 11, 2004 12:29 AM
> >Subject: Re: [TANGO-L] leading the cross, respecting LOD, and zining
out....
> >etc.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >>On Apr 11, 2004, at 2:00 AM, jackie ling wong <jackie.wong@VERIZON.NET>
> >>
> >>
> >wrote:
> >
> >
> >>>because i teach and my vocabulary is large, i'm often asked to dance by
> >>>leaders who want to strut their stuff...
> >>>i can do all the stuff but those dances are not interesting to
me...many
> >>>times it's nicer to dance with beginners who have less vocabulary..
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>Do you then give them their money back, or you just rip them off and
> >>>
> >>>
> >then 'zone' behind their backs?
> >
> >
> >
> >>Hector
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
Date: Sun, 11 Apr 2004 10:59:33 -0500
From: Hector <maselli@GATE.NET>
Subject: Re: leading the cross, respecting LOD, and zining out.... etc.
>>"Do you then give them their money back, or you just rip them off and then
>>'zone' behind their back"
>maybe i wasn't clear...when i say strut their stuff, i'm talking about
>leaders who are dancing by themselves....where there is no consideration for
>the follower...
>...so i'm not
>sure what you mean about "rip them off and zone behind their back".
my apologies, i thought you said you were the teacher.
whoever is the teacher is the one to blame... :-)
dancers don't learn to strut their stuff unless somebody shows them how to do it.
>what's interesting is that when i have participated in discussions about
>tango and "zoning" comes up, there has never, not once, been a negative
>reaction to it...it's surprising to me to receive it now, either on the list
>or in personal emails...maybe it's my email communication skills..:-)
could be, although you sound intelligent and educated.
your writing though, seems to portray a person who might be too conceded and full of herself.
for somebody whose dancing might be minutes old compared to the thousands who have danced all their lives, you talk too much, too soon.
negative??
what did you expect? a nobel prize nomination for the way you put down those who take your classes but don't measure up to your ego? :-)
atenti pebeta, segui mi consejo, yo soy zorro viejo y te quiero bien...
good dancers don't talk, they don't kiss and tell, they accept the recognition of their peers on the dance floor.
hector m.
Date: Sun, 11 Apr 2004 18:27:26 +0200
From: Steffen Pedersen <eskape@MOBILIXNET.DK>
Subject: Re: leading the cross, respecting LOD, and zining out.... etc.
Hi Jackie,
Re you receiving negative comments: I "know" you only
from your postings to this list. And I would really,
really like to dance with you ;-)
Fondest regards - Steffen (of Denmark)
=========
jackie ling wong wrote:
> what's interesting is that when i have participated in discussions about
> tango and "zoning" comes up, there has never, not once, been a negative
> reaction to it...it's surprising to me to receive it now, either on the list
> or in personal emails...maybe it's my email communication skills..:-)
Date: Mon, 12 Apr 2004 07:10:21 -0700
From: roberto vermais <odioesteamor@YAHOO.COM>
Subject: Re: leading the cross, respecting LOD, and zining out.... etc.
I was enjoying reading this thread about the "zone" when these garbage emails from this fool "Hector" popped up, insulting a beautiful dancer Jackie Wong.
I think that to be a good tango dancer, one has to be intelligent and act like a gentleman or lady.
Hector, since you misunderstood what Jackie clearly explained, then that shows you are not intelligent.
Since you insult a lady, then that probably means you are not a gentleman. All this leads me to believe that you are probably not a good dancer.
But it's ok, just stay home and keep writing your emails, hopefully that will keep you off the dance floor.
Hector <maselli@GATE.NET> wrote:
>>"Do you then give them their money back, or you just rip them off and then
>>'zone' behind their back"
>maybe i wasn't clear...when i say strut their stuff, i'm talking about
>leaders who are dancing by themselves....where there is no consideration for
>the follower...
>...so i'm not
>sure what you mean about "rip them off and zone behind their back".
my apologies, i thought you said you were the teacher.
whoever is the teacher is the one to blame... :-)
dancers don't learn to strut their stuff unless somebody shows them how to do it.
>what's interesting is that when i have participated in discussions about
>tango and "zoning" comes up, there has never, not once, been a negative
>reaction to it...it's surprising to me to receive it now, either on the list
>or in personal emails...maybe it's my email communication skills..:-)
could be, although you sound intelligent and educated.
your writing though, seems to portray a person who might be too conceded and full of herself.
for somebody whose dancing might be minutes old compared to the thousands who have danced all their lives, you talk too much, too soon.
negative??
what did you expect? a nobel prize nomination for the way you put down those who take your classes but don't measure up to your ego? :-)
atenti pebeta, segui mi consejo, yo soy zorro viejo y te quiero bien...
good dancers don't talk, they don't kiss and tell, they accept the recognition of their peers on the dance floor.
hector m.
Date: Mon, 12 Apr 2004 07:48:13 -0700
From: luda_r1 <luda_r1@YAHOO.COM>
Subject: Re: leading the cross, respecting LOD, and zining out.... etc.
Whether it's spelled "zoning" or "zining", I find
Jackie's comments on this topic completely to the
point and on the mark, presented with style and grace.
Not surprisingly, Manuel's response, on the other
hand, is condescending, patronizing and downright
rude, not to mention full of inaccuracies. Some people
can't seem to make a point without having to put
someone else down and sounding like the be-all and
end-all of all experts. Talk about "affectation"! So
tiresome. Just like Alberto Paz. Expert my eye!!!
Luda
Date: Sat, 10 Apr 2004 12:40:30 -0700
From: jackie ling wong <jackie.wong@VERIZON.NET>
Subject: Re: leading the cross, respecting LOD, and
zining out.... etc.
this dialogue is very interesting to me because i am
surprized at what
people read into the word "zone"...
i don't think people who are flapping their arms like
chickens, or running
over people, or impeding the flow of the LOD,
are truly "zoning"..how can you?,...it would feel more
like bumper cars...my
best zones are with leaders who are focused on me "the
follower"...
i can accommodate various "styles" of dancing from the
leader and still
"zone"..maybe the technique is not exact,
(in fact, one of our favorite leaders bends over the
follower) but the
attention is on the music and "us"...and that doesn't
mean forgetting about
the LOD...because to be focused on the follower, you
need to take care that
they don't get hurt...
personally i'm tired of dancing with leaders who are
"in" their feet...where
i feel as if i am an ornament...
give me a considerate leader and i'm in heaven...give
me a wonderful smooth
walk and i'm in heaven......
because i teach and my vocabulary is large, i'm often
asked to dance by
leaders who want to strut their stuff...
i can do all the stuff but those dances are not
interesting to me...many
times it's nicer to dance with beginners who have less
vocabulary..
jackie
> Now, the famous "zone"... While it's true that one
gets "lost" in the
dance
> and when both dancers are skilled, the music is
right, and the crowd is
"in
> the groove", It's easy and very pleasurable to dance
almost effortlessly
and
> almost "automatically". However, just closing the
eyes and affecting some
> sort of dreamy expression does not make one a good
dancer. I see too many
> folks dance with strange affectations, with eyes
closed and flapping their
> arms like chickens, while impeding the flow along
the LOD or running over
> other dancers. Lack of skill and manners cannot be
hid or disguised with
> some silly affectation. Unless the dancers are
really good, they should
> leave the affectations alone and concentrate in
developing the skills
needed
> to navigate the floor smoothly, elegantly "and" most
of all, dancing
actual
> tango. Yes, if all you can do is plod along with
eyes closed stopping
often
> and blocking the flow, you need to learn more about
the tango, take more
> lessons, practice, and dance with your eyes open so
you can do the simple
> salidas, and half turns to the right and left with
ocho cortado. learn to
do
> cortes and how to use the rhythmic music of tango
with all the slow and
> quick steps needed to dance. Then you can understand
how to "navigate" and
> respect the LOD, and yes, how to lead and follow the
8 count basic too. Of
> course those of you who are great dancers (and a
pleasure to watch as to
> dance with ;)) please dance with your eyes closed
and a blissfull
> expression. You've earned it!
>
> Tango education to all,
>
> Manuel
>
>
=====
Date: Mon, 12 Apr 2004 11:16:43 -0400
From: Ender Malkoc <ender@PAGOS.COM>
Subject: Re: leading the cross, respecting LOD, and zining out.... etc.
I find it very ironic to see you disqualify yourself for being a
gentlemen. Gentlemen don't call someone a fool or their opinion garbage.
This is neither to approve Hectors e-mail (I don't even know him) nor to
put Jackie down. (I am sure she is a beatufil lady and a great dancer)
You read Hector's email and see a fool writing garbage. I see a bitter
man using harsh words towards Tango teaching.
He is criticizing a common trend in tango teaching that I don't like
either. Some of the teachers teach their students too many figures
whereas all they need
is a clean technique. These students are unaware that they can create a
beatiful dance only with very basic steps. Some of these instructors do
this intentionally
so that they don't loose their students because they know that most
beginners drop out if you don't teach them new things.
However this is no excuse to attack and use harsh words against anyone.
And I don't find it appropriate to assume Jackie doing this with what
she wrote here. And even
if she is, maybe I am totally wrong and maybe beginners should be
thought everything. After all I am nowhere near her expertise level and
what I wrote is only my humble
opinion. Finally even if she is doing something wrong this is not the
way to correct it.
One of the goals of this discussion list is to grow and improve the
tango community. You guys aren't helping....
Ender
-----Original Message-----
From: roberto vermais [mailto:odioesteamor@YAHOO.COM]
Sent: Monday, April 12, 2004 10:10 AM
To: TANGO-L@MITVMA.MIT.EDU
Subject: Re: [TANGO-L] leading the cross, respecting LOD, and zining
out.... etc.
I was enjoying reading this thread about the "zone" when these garbage
emails from this fool "Hector" popped up, insulting a beautiful dancer
Jackie Wong.
I think that to be a good tango dancer, one has to be intelligent and
act like a gentleman or lady.
Hector, since you misunderstood what Jackie clearly explained, then that
shows you are not intelligent.
Since you insult a lady, then that probably means you are not a
gentleman. All this leads me to believe that you are probably not a good
dancer.
But it's ok, just stay home and keep writing your emails, hopefully that
will keep you off the dance floor.
Hector <maselli@GATE.NET> wrote:
>>"Do you then give them their money back, or you just rip them off and
>>then 'zone' behind their back"
>maybe i wasn't clear...when i say strut their stuff, i'm talking about
>leaders who are dancing by themselves....where there is no
>consideration for the follower...
>...so i'm not
>sure what you mean about "rip them off and zone behind their back".
my apologies, i thought you said you were the teacher.
whoever is the teacher is the one to blame... :-) dancers don't learn to
strut their stuff unless somebody shows them how to do it.
>what's interesting is that when i have participated in discussions
>about tango and "zoning" comes up, there has never, not once, been a
>negative reaction to it...it's surprising to me to receive it now,
>either on the list or in personal emails...maybe it's my email
>communication skills..:-)
could be, although you sound intelligent and educated.
your writing though, seems to portray a person who might be too conceded
and full of herself.
for somebody whose dancing might be minutes old compared to the
thousands who have danced all their lives, you talk too much, too soon.
negative??
what did you expect? a nobel prize nomination for the way you put down
those who take your classes but don't measure up to your ego? :-)
atenti pebeta, segui mi consejo, yo soy zorro viejo y te quiero bien...
good dancers don't talk, they don't kiss and tell, they accept the
recognition of their peers on the dance floor.
hector m.
"subscribe Tango-A Firstname Lastname" to LISTSERV@MITVMA.MIT.EDU.
Date: Mon, 12 Apr 2004 15:26:05 -0700
From: luda_r1 <luda_r1@YAHOO.COM>
Subject: Re: leading the cross, respecting LOD, and zining out.... etc.
Jackie,
There's absolutely nothing wrong with your
communication skills! Your point comes across loud and
clear, and elegant to boot! However, there's a great
deal to be desired with the LISTENING skills of
certain people on this List, whose arrogance and bad
manners are only exceeded by their total absence of
common sense, and a complete lack of respect or
consideration for anybody! There are none so blind as
those who will not see, and none so deaf as those who
will not hear!! And folks like Hector are both, blind
AND deaf! They're so in love with themselves and the
sound of their own voice they can't see beyond the tip
of their very short nose, or keep from writing
endless, rambling messages singing their own praises!
They couldn't interpret a clear and straightforward
message if it came up and bit them! I apologize for
their insensitivity and lack of good taste, because
they obviously don't have the wherewithal to do it
themselves. You seem to be new to the List, and I
wouldn't want you to get the wrong impression that all
people on it subscribe to the perverse thinking of a
small minority, and are willing to be bullied by them!
Hector further writes:
>my apologies, i thought you said you were the
teacher.
>whoever is the teacher is the one to blame... :-)
>dancers don't learn to strut their stuff unless
>somebody shows them how to do it.
Aside from twisting Jackie's comments in order to be
even more insulting and patronizing, you are
completely wrong about dancers not strutting their
stuff "unless somebody shows them how to do it". They
do it because that's the way they are in the world, in
all aspects of their lives, not just tango.
"Strutting" has to do with attitude, and is not a
learned skill. If you're the kind who is into
strutting, and I have every reason to believe that you
are, you don't need any lessons. It's a natural
"talent". Unfortunately. I feel sorry for your dance
partners.
>what's interesting is that when i have participated
in discussions about
>tango and "zoning" comes up, there has never, not
once, been a negative
>reaction to it...it's surprising to me to receive it
now, either on the list
>or in personal emails...maybe it's my email
communication skills..:-)
>could be, although you sound intelligent and
educated.
>your writing though, seems to portray a person who
>might be too conceded and full of herself.
>for somebody whose dancing might be minutes old
>compared to the thousands who have danced all their
>lives, you talk too much, too soon.
The one who's "full of himself" and "conceded" (I
assume you mean "conceited"?) is YOU, Hector! It never
ceases to amaze me how low people will sink in order
to boost their pathetic little egos! How sad.
Especially for your dance partners. If you even have
any, which I doubt. Who needs it? Having to deal with
all that strutting?! You think that because you may
have a few more years' experience dancing than Jackie,
just because you've lived longer, you are so much
better, on that basis alone? Well, I've got news for
you. I know any number of braggarts like you who have
danced all their lives, and they're just as rotten now
as they were when they first started! According to
their wives, anyway.
?negative??
>what did you expect? a nobel prize nomination for the
>way you put down those who take your classes but
>don't
>measure up to your ego? :-)
This remark is not just beneath contempt, it's even
lower than that! And a sorry testament to the way your
twisted little brain works! Jackie has not made a
single remark during this entire discussion that would
indicate she "put anybody" down, except maybe those
pathetic and inept show-offs who make the lives of
followers everywhere miserable, and who amply deserve
it!! YOU, however, have been piling it on with a
shovel!! And you especially should know better, since
it sounds like you've been around for a while!
>atenti pebeta, segui mi consejo, yo soy zorro viejo y
>te quiero bien...good dancers don't talk, they don't
>kiss and tell, they accept the recognition of their
>peers on the dance floor.
>hector m.
You obviously don't seem to get any, recognition that
is, or you wouldn't be "strutting your stuff" so
relentlessly, or so aggressively. Tangueros are
supposed to be chivalrous. Not only do you not possess
a shred of that noble quality, you don't seem to be
able to scrape up even a minute quanity of the most
basic of garden-variety rules of decent human conduct:
common courtesy. Que lastima, "zorro viejo"! What a
pity, old man.
Luda
>maybe i wasn't clear...when i say strut their stuff,
>i'm talking about leaders who are dancing by
>themselves.... where there is no consideration for
the follower...one example is when there is a birthday
dance and the follower is a beginner...you won't
believe how many times i have seen leaders "strut
their stuff" and cause the beginner, during their
birthday dance, to trip and stumble and race to keep
up with their lead...so i'm not sure what you mean
about "rip them off and zone behind their back".
>someone asked me if i lead....i most certainly
>do...and i love it... what's interesting is that when
i have participated in discussions about tango and
"zoning" comes up, there has never, not once, been a
negative reaction to it... it's surprising to me to
receive it now, either on the list or in personal
emails...maybe it's my email communication skills..:-)
www.tangopulse.net
>because i teach and my vocabulary is large, i'm
often asked to dance by leaders who want to strut
their stuff... i can do all the stuff but those dances
are not interesting to me...many times it's nicer to
dance with beginners who have less vocabulary..
> > Do you then give them their money back, or you
just rip them off and
then 'zone' behind their backs?
> Hector
=====
