3668  A Nuevo Experience

Date: Thu, 4 Aug 2005 23:15:47 -0700
From: Trini or Sean - PATangoS <patangos@YAHOO.COM>
Subject: A Nuevo Experience

I hope this post allows for an intelligent discussion,
not a war between styles.

This past weekend I did an intensive exchange with an
excellent Nuevo partner. He was teaching me nuevo (is
there a name for the American version?), I was
teaching him milonguero. My intent was to get a
different approach to dancing and learn different
techniques for movement. After our exchange, we both
began to appreciate better why many Argentines did not
consider the style to be Argentine tango.

Earlier on this list I asked what was it about the
alternative music that allowed the longer, flowing
movements of the nuevo style. Ramiro Garcia suggested
the wandering beat of the alternative music which
allowed dancers to skip a beat or two. I think that
is quite true. I also noticed that it allowed more
time to recover from mistakes (a plus for beginners,
though a minus on their learning musicality). For
example, in traditional tango, if a mistake is made,
it can be easily felt musically and there is an urge
to recover. In nuevo, when something was unclear, I
would just hang-out longer with my one leg loose until
my partner gave me a strong marca to continue. This
usually occurred when he was painting the floor with
my free leg as an ornament and leading it into a
gancho or a colgada.

I began to sense that nuevo did not have the same
machismo of traditional tango. For example, because
my leg had to be really loose, he would sometimes do a
trial & error thing to get my leg into the desired
position. I cant imagine a milonguero doing that.
Also, I felt freer to do suggest movements to my
partner. These changes seemed to make the style less
Argentine to me.

His realization came once I taught him how to listen
to his partner better. In the beginning of our
milonguero session, he continued to try some nuevo
elements, notably small colgadas. After the listening
exercise, he realized that he didnt want to do those
elements. He felt it change our dynamic to something
more disconnected. Though, I dont think it was that
much different from the (dis)connection I have with
salon dancers (relative to the intense connection I
achieve with milonguero dancers).

At a subsequent practica, I noted how odd it looked to
practice those figures to traditional music (it was
fine with the alternative music). On much earlier
occasions, I noted how difficult it was to dance
traditional tango to some alternative music, which I
attributed to bad deejaying since I was aware of
alternative music that is good for traditional
dancing. Now, I think that that difficulty could be
fixed to some degree by dancing this new style with
that music.

One of our students just called and commented how much
fun it was to watch Sean & I practice the figures.
She said we looked like we were having so much fun,
like kids. I think that is one of the things I like
about nuevo. Our students also loved this style and
have been diligently practicing.

I also liked the softness of the movements (foot
drags, ganchos, sacadas) much better than salon
versions. The music suggested more romance than
heartbreak and it reflected in the movements. I
suppose one could say that lack of nostalgia could
make it less Argentine, as well.

Id be interested in hearing other non-judgemental
comments from those who have studied both styles.




PATangoS - Pittsburgh Argentine Tango Society
Our Mission: To make Argentine Tango Pittsburgh's most popular social dance.
https://www.pitt.edu/~mcph/PATangoWeb.htm

Date: Mon, 8 Aug 2005 16:10:17 -0700
From: Sean de PATangoS <patangos@YAHOO.COM>
Subject: A nuevo experience

You've heard from Trini on the subject. Here are
Sean's opinions about Nuevo:

Disclaimer:

These are the opinions of a traditional tango addict.
They are based on a few hours of Nuevo experience.
Were I to pursue this further, my opinions might
change.

Observations:

1. Dancing Nuevo is a fun diversion, like swing
dancing. Tango no es para divertir.
2. There is definitely a connection between the
partners in Nuevo. It's not narcotic like the
connection in Argentine tango. I can't imagine a nuevo
dancer "chasing the ghost".
3. Nuevo is musical, and has its own music. The
relationship between nuevo dancing and its music is
not as compelling as the relationship between
Argentine tango dancing and its music.
4. Like swing and Salsa, Nuevo is much easier than
tango.

Conclusions:

1. It seems that there is nothing wrong with Nuevo, or
the people who dance it.
2. Nuevo is not Argentine tango. Yes, I know it was
developed by porteqos. But they called it Nuevo, not
Tango Nuevo.

Musings:

Nuevo has an exhibitionist side, but it seems more
wholesome than fantasia.

In tango, the music is always more important than the
figure, because a figure executed without musicality
is empty  a nothing event. Nuevo is best danced to
the music, but the hierarchy is flexible. If you don't
dance musically, you can still have something. I
recommend Nuevo dancing to everyone who loves fancy
figures, but gets bored when the discussion turns to
connection or musicality. I also recommend Nuevo to
people who just want to have fun.

I have a new appreciation for Clay Nelson, who rented
a second hall and played alternative music for the
nuevo dancers at the last Valentango Ball. These two
distinct dances really aren't compatible. Dancing
tango to nuevo music can be frustrating. IMHO, dancing
Nuevo to tango music is like drinking Coors Light at a
Cognac party. (No offense to the mountain crowd  I
know that you truly believe that Coors is beer. :)

Trini and I both love the golden age tangos.
Nonetheless, she once admitted that she likes an
occasional alternative tanda. It's the only time she
can bear dancing with her non-musical friends. I may
dance nuevo for a similar reason, with my
non-connectible friends.

Dancing Nuevo is very stylish. Some people are
obsessed with style. I prefer substance. Were I to
pursue this Nuevo further, my opinions might change.
But I have to ask myself, "Why bother?"

Date: Tue, 9 Aug 2005 13:35:51 -0500
From: Michael Ditkoff <tangomaniac@CAVTEL.NET>
Subject: Re: A Nuevo Experience

I think it's better to begin with close. When you emphasize
close, you're emphasizing the physical connection. I found
it very helpful to tell beginning men to lead with their
hands at their sides and the woman's arms around their neck.
(Note: This can be dangerous because I've seen some upset
women instead go for the man's throat!!! LOL) The man needs
to feel the woman moving because his chest is moving.

When you start teaching open, the tendency is for men to use
their arms to push (not lead) the woman. Men need to feel
their upper body moving first. Unless he is extremely
relaxed, he won't realize he is pushing. Of course, the
woman knows!! But then, she thinks that's how it's supposed
to be. Starting in close will also force both partners to
deal with the "stepping on the foot" syndrome. Instead of
moving straight, each partner tries to step around the other
partner's foot. But they don't understand the partner's foot
ISN'T directly in front of them when the lead is correct.
The late, great, Carlos Gavito is quoted: "I lead, but I
follow." Until a man understands that, he is going to have a
rought time dancing tango.

Michael Ditkoff
Usually from Washington, DC
Vacationing on MS Ryndam in Ketchikan, Alaska

Not as nice as the Staten Island Ferry, but it will have to
do!!

Going through painful tango withdrawal. Have to wait until
8/17 in Anchorage.
"All night milonga" takes on a new meaning up here in Alaska
during the winter.



Trini wrote:

>

That open was the base with close thrown in. It seems to
me that perhaps close would be the better base with open
embrace used for accents. What

> do you think?
>
> Trini de Pittsburgh
>