20 Sitting one out (Rated R)
Date: Mon, 18 Jun 2001 11:37:56 -0700
From: Mark Sussex <doktordogg@YAHOO.COM>
Subject: Sitting one out (Rated R)
Tango can be a dialogue with many overtones and
suggestions. It can be playful, sensual, even erotic.
For me, it's never been overtly...sexual. However, a
new student in class created a ::cough:: problem for
me yesterday. The problem occurred when I danced with
her at a milonga again last night.
I was very embarrassed because I think she had to have
felt the problem briefly at one point. I only hope
she wasn't offended (or worse, disgusted!). I think
not, because after that she only held me closer and
tighter, which didn't help matters at all...(or it
helped a lot depending on a certain point of view).
I'm not an animal! I'm not trying to create that kind
of experience in public at a dance, but I guess with
her I'm not going to be able to prevent this response.
I haven't had this kind of problem in public since
Brenda L. sat in front of me in sophomore math class
25 years ago...
Whaddya do, guys? It's rude to leave a partner in the
middle of a dance, but it might have to happen. Do
you say, "I'm sorry, I just got a terrible cramp." Is
anybody going to be fooled by that?
(Yikers)
Mark
Date: Mon, 18 Jun 2001 14:23:57 -0700
From: Carlos Lima <amilsolrac@YAHOO.COM>
Subject: Re: Sitting one out (Rated R)
Mark Sussex <doktordogg@YAHOO.COM> explains:
> The problem occurred when I danced with her at a milonga again last night.
<
Mark's confidencia would appear to be more of a celebration than a
consultation.
Cheers,
Date: Mon, 18 Jun 2001 16:45:47 -0700
From: ramiro garcia <ramiro9@YAHOO.COM>
Subject: Re: Sitting one out
Bad boy!
No more apilado for you!
--- Mark Sussex <doktordogg@YAHOO.COM> wrote:
> Tango can be a dialogue with many overtones and
> suggestions. It can be playful, sensual, even erotic.
> For me, it's never been overtly...sexual. However, a
> new student in class created a ::cough:: problem for
> me yesterday. The problem occurred when I danced with
> her at a milonga again last night.
>
> ... I only hope she wasn't offended ... I think
> not, because after that she only held me closer and
> tighter ...
>
> Mark
>
=====
ramiro garcia
ramiro9@yahoo.com
---
Men are qualified for civil liberties, in exact proportion to their disposition to put moral chains upon their appetites: in proportion
as their love of justice is above their rapacity.
- Edmund Burke
Date: Mon, 18 Jun 2001 22:51:41 -0600
From: Brian Dunn <brianpdunn@EARTHLINK.NET>
Subject: Re: Sitting one out (Rated R)
Mark wrote:
>>>
Tango can be a dialogue with many overtones and suggestions. It can be
playful, sensual, even erotic.
For me, it's never been overtly...sexual. However, a new student in class
created a ::cough:: problem for
me yesterday. The problem occurred when I danced with her at a milonga
again last night...I was very embarrassed because I think she had to have
felt the problem briefly at one point....I'm not an animal! I'm not trying
to create that kind of experience in public at a dance, but I guess with her
I'm not going to be able to prevent this response...Whaddya do, guys?
Mark,
I also have had this experience with dance partners I didn't know very well.
>>>
I'm not an animal!
<<<
Well, seen from one perspective, you ARE an animal, actually. Not a bad
state of affairs, in many ways. Cut yourself some slack here, so to
speak...after all, it's an involuntary reaction! In my experience, and the
experience of those women I've discussed the subject with, offense is taken
(or not) based not on what happens to you (& yours) involuntarily, but much
more on what conscious choices you make about the situation, and how you
communicate that to your partner. Your choices include:
1) Retreat in shame
2) Ignore "it" and continue dancing
3) "Press your case" with vigor
So it's a matter of personal taste and style, thus leading potentially to
much heated discussion...but to answer your question directly, I'm a #2 kind
of guy, in general, with some explanation as noted below.
First & foremost, if I "touch" my partner in the course of an otherwise
socially acceptable dance, I'm not going to overtly call attention to the
event, and typically she doesn't either. With that in mind, the solution
I've found to the "problem" has two parts: 1) underwear choice beforehand
and 2) choreographic choice afterwards.
You can readily imagine that choosing the right underwear can facilitate
keeping the occasional insistent surprise visitor "closer at hand," so to
speak, and containing his exhuberance within manageable limits. Once the
issue has arisen (and been thus "corraled"), perhaps after some chance
"contact" with your partner, appropriate choreographic choice and clear
leading within a somewhat looser embrace should make clear to your follower
that you're intending to make her feel beautiful in a romantically thrilling
setting (again, this reflects my own taste & style). Thus, potentially
INCIDENTAL and UNACKNOWLEDGED "contact" can fall under the heading of
"expressions of appreciation" akin to a soft sighing breath on her cheek or
in her ear, or an elevated heartbeat, or other involuntary signs of being
swept up in someone's charms...something of a compliment, even, if handled
with grace, dignity and consideration of your partner's feelings.
A short digression - The leader's attitude I'm imagining as I write this was
epitomized in the opening sequence of the movie "Tango Bar" (1988) with Raul
Julia: a dancing couple progresses from being strangers on the street to an
impromptu tango, building heatedly into an erotically-charged passionate
frenzy - but at one point, the woman's skirt flies off, leaving her
near-naked - she retreats from her ardor of moments before, withdrawing from
the encounter in shame - and the man picks up her skirt from where it has
fallen, drapes it gently over her huddled form, and walks away...(I won't
give away how it ends.)
Back to the topic at hand - my female informants have told me that some men
in similar circumstances have taken the situation you describe as an
opportunity for "pressing their case" overtly, embarassingly, and
offensively. One woman reportedly said to the man in question in the middle
of a dance, "Well, I'm glad you're enjoying yourself, because I'm certainly
not." I can easily understand taking offense at being used as a rubbing
post by a stranger...like I said, it's a matter of taste and style.
On the other hand...
>>>
I only hope she wasn't offended (or worse, disgusted!). I think not,
because after that she only held me closer and tighter, which didn't help
matters at all...
<<<
Well, you were there, I wasn't, so I'll have to take your word on it ;> As
Juan Bruno once said, "All that matters in tango is, if you ask her to dance
a second time, does she say yes?" Except for my romantic partner, I haven't
discussed my own such experiences with any of the dance partners involved.
But in all such cases where it was fairly clear to both of us what was
"happening", and where I handled it as described above, all the partners in
question continued to accept my subsequent invitations to dance, leading me
to believe that my approach was at least acceptable to them. From your
report above, it seems to me you did OK, and thus your instincts in the
moment (whatever they were) were correct. Ask her to dance again, and see
if she says yes...
Hang in there, amigo,
Brian Dunn
Boulder, Colorado USA
https://www.danceoftheheart.com
Date: Mon, 18 Jun 2001 23:15:56 -0700
From: john trimble <john.trimble@EXCITE.COM>
Subject: Re: Sitting one out (Rated R)
I've heard it remarked that if you don't get an erection, you're not
tango-ing right. I don't agree, but I do believe that dancing, like
virtually
every other human activity, is occassionally accompanied by hormonal and
emotional arousal. Sorry to break the news, but despite having learned
to dance tango, we're still animals.
As advisor to a college ballroom dance club, I have been called upon to
address this "problem" several times. Mark's discreet posting doesn't
specify
the precise extent of his embrarrasing situation, but regardless of the
circumstances, his situation is not unique.
The most common complaints are sweating, shaking, and loss of mental acuity,
which seem to respond readily to controlled breathing and focusing on
technique. They also tend to fade with experience.
Next most frequent is "Can people tell I've got an erection?" Nobody seems
to be bothered by having one, only that others might notice. Erections
while dancing are
at least as common as erections on other social occassions, and I don't see
much reason to believe they're likelier to be noticed by others on the dance
floor, especially not so long as men carry keys, car remotes, cell phones,
rolls of mints, and other such objects in their pockets.
As for others in the room, nobody's looking, but if they look, they're not
likely to see, and if they see, at least the guys will be too embarrased to
acknowledge.
I've only known ladies in the audience to acknowledge a dance-floor erection
once, Of the affianced couple, they
said, "Oh, look, so and so's got quite an erection. That's sweet".
Gentlemen among my students who disclosed to their girlfriends that dancing
aroused them
subsequently encountered resistance to their dancing with other partners,
even against their rotating in classes. I encouraged those couples to grow
out of it.
It happens sometimes. Working
around your arousal usually has better social results than either running
away or forcing notice upon your partner.
I don't quite know the extent of Mark's predicament, so just to be sure I've
covered the bases... I have reccomended restrictive underwear (jock
straps), and on one occassion I suggested panty liners to someone who
confided that his girlfriend made him dribble. (They favored swing. I
suppose I'd have reccomended condoms if they'd shown equal enthusiasm for
tango).
It seems appropriate to end with a twist on the Smothers Bros. joke: I wear
two condoms (when I tango), so when I take one off, I feel like a wild man!
On Mon, 18 Jun 2001 11:37:56 -0700, Mark Sussex wrote:
> Tango can be a dialogue with many overtones and
> suggestions. It can be playful, sensual, even erotic.
> For me, it's never been overtly...sexual. However, a
> new student in class created a ::cough:: problem for
> me yesterday. The problem occurred when I danced with
> her at a milonga again last night.
>
> I was very embarrassed because I think she had to have
> felt the problem briefly at one point. I only hope
> she wasn't offended (or worse, disgusted!). I think
> not, because after that she only held me closer and
> tighter, which didn't help matters at all...(or it
> helped a lot depending on a certain point of view).
>
> I'm not an animal! I'm not trying to create that kind
> of experience in public at a dance, but I guess with
> her I'm not going to be able to prevent this response.
> I haven't had this kind of problem in public since
> Brenda L. sat in front of me in sophomore math class
> 25 years ago...
>
> Whaddya do, guys? It's rude to leave a partner in the
> middle of a dance, but it might have to happen. Do
> you say, "I'm sorry, I just got a terrible cramp." Is
> anybody going to be fooled by that?
> (Yikers)
>
> Mark
>
>
john.trimble@excite.com
Date: Tue, 19 Jun 2001 08:23:40 -0500
From: Karen Whitesell <kglass@MNTVERNON.NET>
Subject: Re: Sitting one out (Rated R)
Like any embellishment, a tango erection works well if it doesn't get in the
way of the dance.
It's actually kind of flattering that your beautiful dance should provoke
such an emotional response.
Containment is the key. It's good when you know it's there, but bad if it
flops around in the way and you feel you have to go around it.
Ah ha! Maybe the open embrace does have some place in tango after all.
Karen, sigh
