5281 Leaving for BsAs tomorrow
Date: Thu, 8 Nov 2007 17:43:59 -0600
From: "Lois Donnay" <donnay@donnay.net>
Subject: [Tango-L] Leaving for BsAs tomorrow
To: <tango-l@mit.edu>
I am off to Buenos Aires for the next four weeks, and as always, am
interested in the changes that I will see since my last visit. I hear that
inflation has increased prices 18%, and I am sure that it has hit the tango
economy even harder. I have heard that the milongas have changed, some more
crowded, most with fewer Portenos.
I am especially interested in the level of dancing. I would think that a
better understanding of the dance and focus on improvement throughout the
world, that the level has gotten higher. I am also thinking that the
Argentines who are recent converts to tango are realizing the high level of
dancing of the foreigners and are "stepping up", so to speak. This may be
great news for us visitors.
I will have a group with me again, and it is always great to see this
beautiful city through the eyes of the newcomers.
Lois Donnay
Minnepaolis, MN
Date: Thu, 8 Nov 2007 21:06:09 -0800
From: ELEMER DUBROVAY <elemer_7@msn.com>
Subject: Re: [Tango-L] Leaving for BsAs tomorrow
To: Tango-L <tango-l@mit.edu>
Is this a joke?
Are we recent converts to tango, realizing that the foreigners are better dancers than us?
Elemer, Redmond
Windows Live Hotmail and Microsoft Office Outlook ? together at last. ?Get it now.
https://office.microsoft.com/en-us/outlook/HA102225181033.aspx?pid=CL100626971033
Date: Fri, 9 Nov 2007 08:53:40 -0500
From: WHITE 95 R <white95r@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Tango-L] Leaving for BsAs tomorrow
To: ELEMER DUBROVAY <elemer_7@msn.com>, Tango-L <tango-l@mit.edu>
Elemer,
I think that Lois is saying that the prospects of tango for her traveling companions are quite good because the newcomer dancers *in Argentina* are seeing that foreigners that come to BsAs dance tango better than they do and that everybody's level of tango dancing has improved as a result of that. However, I'm not sure that others would agree with her theory. Anyway, I wish Lois good luck with her trip and I'm sure her companions will love BsAs.
Cheers,
Manuel
visit our webpage
www.tango-rio.com
> From: elemer_7@msn.com
> To: tango-l@mit.edu
> Date: Thu, 8 Nov 2007 21:06:09 -0800
> Subject: Re: [Tango-L] Leaving for BsAs tomorrow
>
> Is this a joke?
> Are we recent converts to tango, realizing that the foreigners are better dancers than us?
>
> Elemer, Redmond
>
>
I am especially interested in the level of dancing. I would think that a> better understanding of the dance and focus on improvement throughout the> world, that the level has gotten higher. I am also thinking that the> Argentines who are recent converts to tango are realizing the high level of> dancing of the foreigners and are "stepping up", so to speak. This may be> great news for us visitors.>> I will have a group with me again, and it is always great to see this> beautiful city through the eyes of the newcomers.>
Date: Fri, 9 Nov 2007 09:43:41 -0800
From: "Brick Robbins" <brick@fastpack.com>
Subject: Re: [Tango-L] Leaving for BsAs tomorrow
To: tango-l@mit.edu
<ca2c2380711090943t7154beectc0880fffe892e96e@mail.gmail.com>
ELEMER DUBROVAY <elemer_7@msn.com> wrote:
>Is this a joke?
>Are we recent converts to tango, realizing that the
>foreigners are better dancers than us?
Is this arrogance?
Is every Argentinian a fabulous Tangeuro/a by Birthright?
Are there no poor Argentine dancers?
The Tango Tourists have at least shown enough dedication and interest
in Tango to make the pilgrimage to BsA. Some of these will be very
good dancers... they will even be better than the Porten~os who take
only a casual interest in Tango.
Date: Fri, 9 Nov 2007 16:00:55 -0300 (ART)
From: Lucia <curvasreales@yahoo.com.ar>
Subject: Re: [Tango-L] Leaving for BsAs tomorrow
To: Brick Robbins <brick@fastpack.com>, tango-l@mit.edu
Brick Robbins <brick@fastpack.com> escribi?:
Is every Argentinian a fabulous Tangeuro/a by Birthright?
Are there no poor Argentine dancers?
The Tango Tourists [snip].. will even be better than the Porten~os who take only a casual interest in Tango.
Sorry to disappoint you, but Tango dancing Argentines are truly better, in general, than dancers hailing from non-Tango dancing societies. To understand why, it is worth re-reading the following words of wisdom from Sergio Vandekier.
Thanks Sergio,
Lucia
--------------
Lucia says: "Some people are born athletes. Some are not. Some are
born
dancers, some are
not. These are natural traits, gifts, and one may not achieve the hoped
for
resultats, regardless of the effort put in."
I can assure you that Lucia's view is shared by a great number of
Argentines.
When it comes to any artistic activity you are classified very early in
life
as having aptitude and then you are encouraged to study and perfect
yourself or not having it and then you are discouraged and guided to do
something else.
People think that you are born with a genetical structure that will
allow
you to exhibit certain skills but you may, on the other hand,
congenitally
lack conditions to succeed in certain endeavors.
Accordingly and although education is free through graduate school.
Many
people do not go to the University because they think that they lack
the
necessary conditions.
People will say " He is very good for music" or " painting" or
"dancing"
etc. or else they will say
"el no tiene oido para la musica" (he has no ear for music) , etc.
With respect to dancing if you are not graceful from the very beginning
you
are classified as being "pata dura" (stiff legged). This classification
is a
terrible handicap very difficult to overcome.
The frequent result is that you will never attempt to dance "because
you are
convinced that you have no conditions".
In the States on the other hand it does not matter what natural ability
you
have or you do not have, you are encouraged to continue and acquire the
maximum possible development within your possibilities.
Here however children are also classified into "gifted" and then they
are
taught in a more accelerated form or "normal" or "handicapped" so that
their
education is adjusted to their degree of intelligence.
Argentina has a tendency to mix children of different intelligence
degree
because it is though that this mixture is a reflection of life in
general
and prepares them better to live in society.
Especial education is provided for handicapped children.
The result of this mentality is that in the States you find a great
number
of mediocre dancers on the floor. Although they may not be graceful or
gifted they manage to socialize and have great fun dancing.
In Argentina the number of such people is more reduced because the ones
that
were not "blessed" by nature do not dance. So they will have to have
fun
doing something different.
I hope that this helps to understand, best regards, Sergio.
Compart? video en la ventana de tus mensajes y tambi?n tus fotos de Flickr.
Us?el Nuevo Yahoo! Messenger versi?n Beta.
Date: Fri, 9 Nov 2007 16:36:44 -0300
From: "Janis Kenyon" <Jantango@feedback.net.ar>
Subject: Re: [Tango-L] Leaving for BsAs tomorrow
To: "Tango-L" <Tango-L@MIT.EDU>
Lois Donnay wrote:
I am off to Buenos Aires for the next four weeks, and as always, am
interested in the changes that I will see since my last visit. I hear that
inflation has increased prices 18%, and I am sure that it has hit the tango
economy even harder. I have heard that the milongas have changed, some more
crowded, most with fewer Portenos.>>
The first thing you'll notice is the increase in Remis and taxi rates from
Ezeiza to the city. There have been several increases in the basic taxi
fare in the past five years. I used to be able to take a taxi home from my
favorite milonga for 3 pesos; now the fare begins at 3.10. The subway is
still 70 centavos, and buses are 80 centavos.
Entradas at the milongas are 10 pesos. I went to Nino Bien last night where
the entrada is 12 pesos which includes the first drink. This makes milongas
more expensive for portenos who don't go to dance as often as they used to.
Nino Bien, organized by Luis Calvo and Gaby, has been operating for nine
years. The large venue Centro Region Leonesa on Humberto Primo has four
milongas each week. Thursday nights attract more foreigners than the other
nights. I saw it for myself last night. Deby and I were seated in the last
table in the back by the emergency exit. We didn't have a reservation, and
the place was full by the time we arrived at 11:00. We later moved to a
table near the dance floor when a group left. The majority of dancers were
foreigners (95%) with only a handful of locals. I didn't bother to bring
dance shoes because I knew there would be no one with whom I wanted to
dance. The sound level is pumped up for the music to be heard above all the
conversation of 400 people. The floor was impossible for dancing. I stayed
later than I expected because I was enjoying the conversation with everyone
at our table. The tables are full of fliers for shoes, milongas, shows,
etc. due to the high percentage of foreigners at Nino Bien.
<I am especially interested in the level of dancing. I would think that a
better understanding of the dance and focus on improvement throughout the
world, that the level has gotten higher.>
Poor teaching doesn't improve the level of dancing. I cringe when I read
the people who are leaving Buenos Aires to travel and teach. I believe
there is still a misunderstanding about how tango has been danced for
decades in the downtown milongas. The focus is on making money, not
producing good dancers. People cannot learn to dance well for the milonga
by studying with teachers who don't dance in the milongas.
What's new is salon tango with a bit of nuevo figures in traditional
milongas. I saw this for the first time this week, and the dancers were
foreigners. There were two couples on Wednesday evening who sat separately.
When they danced together, they danced nuevo figures that they learned
together in class.
