3834 Milongueo del Ayer - The language of Argentina
Date: Fri, 23 Sep 2005 14:53:11 +0000
From: Sergio Vandekier <sergiovandekier990@HOTMAIL.COM>
Subject: Milongueo del Ayer - The language of Argentina
ASTRID SAYS: "Milonguea del
>Ayer. > Regarding the funny spelling of milonga in the title,
>we will have to
>ask some Argentines.
>
In the Argentines' language (can this called be Castellano in this case?)
there is not only the noun "la milonga" but also the verb "milonguear". I
suppose, "milonguea del ayer" must mean "He has been dancing since
yesterday".
The correct name of this very well known music of Abel Fleury is " Milongueo
del ayer".
Milongueo is a noun form the result of a verbal action, it comes from
milonguear. It means then the result of the act of dancing milonga.
Milongueo del ayer : means : The product resulting from the act of dancing
milonga in the old times.
Similarly from Cantar (to sing) one has canturrear (to sing in low voice)
and then canturreo (the result or object of the act of singing in low
voice). Canturrear - canturreo.
As to the language spoken in Argentina. It is Spanish . Since Spain has four
mayor languages (Castilian, Catalonian, Galician and Vasque) and a number of
dialects and the language taken to the colonies is Castilian we say that we
speak Castilian.
Spain recognizes the existence of its languages and dialects and they are
all taught in school along with the official language : The Castilian also
known as Spanish.
Castilian like all the languages of the world has evolved throughout the
times. So we have "Old Castilian" and "Modern Castilian". Old Castilian is
still spoken by Sephardic Jewish communities in Israel and in the North of
Africa.
Argentina along with some countries in Central America still uses a form of
Old Castilian in familiar speech, but all the countries of the Spanish
Empire speak Castilian with certain different pronunciation or intonation
depending on the areas of the world or inside the same country, the same as
it happens with English in The USA or in England.
Further more some words are in popular use in same areas and have been
forgotten or are for highly educated use in other, some nations enriched
their language by incorporating indian native words to their popular speech.
Summary: despite of the differences above mentioned everyone understands any
member of the Spanish Community except for some isolated words.
The language of Argentina is Castilian but and archaic form is used for
familiar speech.
Best regards, Sergio.
Date: Sat, 24 Sep 2005 01:40:57 +0900
From: astrid <astrid@RUBY.PLALA.OR.JP>
Subject: Re: Milongueo del Ayer - The language of Argentina
> Milongueo del ayer : means : The product resulting from the act of dancing
> milonga in the old times.
And what kind of product would that signify?
Could that not be simply another misprint , like Julio said?
Date: Fri, 23 Sep 2005 15:08:07 -0300
From: Alberto Gesualdi <clambat2001@YAHOO.COM.AR>
Subject: Milongueo del ayer
Dear friends from tango list
The explanation about Milongueo del ayer that gave Sergio Vandekier , is the meaning that this word "milongueo" has.
Milonguear , milongueo, milonguea , has not yet included into the dictionary of the Real Academia Espaniola , the only entry is for "milonga" defined as a female noun used to describe a tune sung in the Rio de la Plata area, usually with guitar, and also the dance with the same name.
SADAIC , the argentine association of authors and composers, made an improvement on their website at www.sadaic.org.ar , and now they have a new service, a data base that provides information concerning the registered music at the association to collect copyrights ( not only tango, all kind of music )
I introduce the query "Milongueo del ayer" and this is what it says the database .It gives the registered name , Milongueo del ayer, the author , Fleury , the code for the data base, 1253 , and below , the code for the copyrights to be paid to the author Abel Fleury , and the code to pay the copyright of the script that was reserved by Editorial Lagos, the first publisher.
warm regards
alberto gesualdi
buenos aires
p.s. I will make a separate comment about "Milonguea del ayer"
Tmtulo:T | MILONGUEO DEL AYER
S | MILONGUEO DEL AYER -FLEURY
Csdigo: 1253
Autor / Derechos
Csdigo
Autor / Derechos
Categorma
Soc.
Ejecucisn
Soc.
Fono
N | FLEURY ABEL
1051
Compositor
SADAIC
SADAIC
N | EDITORIAL LAGOS
10046
Editor
SADAIC
SADAIC
Abrm tu cuenta aqum
Date: Fri, 23 Sep 2005 23:41:02 -0700
From: Gregory Nisnevich <gren@GREN-MUSIC.COM>
Subject: Re: Milongueo del Ayer - The language of Argentina
Hello, Astrid, Sergio and everyone,
From a point of view of a classical guitarist, who has performed Milongueo
del Ayer many times, including at CITA 2005 in Buenos Aires at Teatro
Astral and at Salon Canning for a performance with Julio Balmaceda and
Corina de la Rosa, I wouldn't consider seriously the title of this piece.
The importance of this piece is in its composition. In my opinion, it is
the most simple and yet extremely interesting piece by Abel Fleury.
This piece is based on a most simple harmony (only two chords!).
Rhythmically and musically, it is a perfect milonga with some space for
improvisation. There is also influence of folklore, Baroque and
polyrhythmic styles.
Every time I teach this milonga to my guitar or tango students, I see
their desire to improvise immediately after they become familiar with this
music because its simplicity makes it possible to show their own unique
creative ideas.
I believe that this simple music was written by Fleury at a time when
there was a huge development of musical compositions for guitar. Any
piece based only on two chords and being technically pretty simple, could
not be taken seriously in the world of guitar music. And yet Fleury was a
well-respected composer and guitarist.
It is possible that the title of this piece is more reflective of its
simple nature. This is a little gem created with a lot of love. A name
that Fleury gave it, may have simply protected the composer from criticism
of giving a bigger, louder name to such a little piece of music. May be
there was another reason...
In classical music, a little fuga could be called fugetta and a little
symphony is called symphonietta. So maybe the answer to the question about
the name of this piece is hidden somewhere in its music, something like a
simple milonga, but not little, in a sense of it being an extremely
serious piece of music.
Best regards,
Gregory Nisnevich
Denver, Colorado
> ASTRID SAYS: "Milonguea del
>
>>Ayer. > Regarding the funny spelling of milonga in the title,
>>we will have to
>>ask some Argentines.
>>
> In the Argentines' language (can this called be Castellano in this case?)
> there is not only the noun "la milonga" but also the verb "milonguear". I
> suppose, "milonguea del ayer" must mean "He has been dancing since
> yesterday".
>
>
> The correct name of this very well known music of Abel Fleury is "
> Milongueo
> del ayer".
>
> Milongueo is a noun form the result of a verbal action, it comes from
> milonguear. It means then the result of the act of dancing milonga.
>
> Milongueo del ayer : means : The product resulting from the act of dancing
> milonga in the old times.
>
> Similarly from Cantar (to sing) one has canturrear (to sing in low voice)
> and then canturreo (the result or object of the act of singing in low
> voice). Canturrear - canturreo.
>
> As to the language spoken in Argentina. It is Spanish . Since Spain has
> four
> mayor languages (Castilian, Catalonian, Galician and Vasque) and a number
> of
> dialects and the language taken to the colonies is Castilian we say that
> we
> speak Castilian.
>
> Spain recognizes the existence of its languages and dialects and they are
> all taught in school along with the official language : The Castilian also
> known as Spanish.
>
> Castilian like all the languages of the world has evolved throughout the
> times. So we have "Old Castilian" and "Modern Castilian". Old Castilian is
> still spoken by Sephardic Jewish communities in Israel and in the North
> of
> Africa.
>
> Argentina along with some countries in Central America still uses a form
> of
> Old Castilian in familiar speech, but all the countries of the Spanish
> Empire speak Castilian with certain different pronunciation or intonation
> depending on the areas of the world or inside the same country, the same
> as
> it happens with English in The USA or in England.
>
> Further more some words are in popular use in same areas and have been
> forgotten or are for highly educated use in other, some nations enriched
> their language by incorporating indian native words to their popular
> speech.
>
> Summary: despite of the differences above mentioned everyone understands
> any
> member of the Spanish Community except for some isolated words.
>
> The language of Argentina is Castilian but and archaic form is used for
> familiar speech.
>
> Best regards, Sergio.
>
>
