1773 "Neo Tango"
Date: Wed, 3 Sep 2003 13:13:22 -0500
From: "Frank G. Williams" <frankw@MAIL.AHC.UMN.EDU>
Subject: Re: "Neo Tango"
Friends,
Concerning Sharna Fabiano's 'The Rise of Neo Tango Music':
https://www.sharnafabiano.com/ar-neotango.html
There is a lot that could be said, but my first reactions to Sharna's ideas
are twofold.
First, Sharna writes, "so deep is the need for new tangos that adventurous
dancers of today are claiming music from genres across the board: blues,
rock, disco, fado, and countless world music sub-categories."
I'm asking myself, why do dancers 'need' new tango music? I think that it's
fine that they do seek new music, and I think they do it because change, per
se, is energizing and stimulating. I believe that the talent needed to
evolve one's own expressions *in movement* is significantly more demanding
than merely changing the music and moving the same way (or nearly so) to
that new sound. As dancers, most of us emulate rather than innovate. So
there is really no 'creative leap' for dancers to adopt new music or other
genres. It's the easy way to change: express the emotions of new music
using the same (old?) dance vocabulary.
Second, Sharna continues: "At a workshop on this subject in Rochester, NY,
my students came up with three essential characteristics that a compelling
Neo Tango shares with a Golden Age Tango: 1. It has a consistent, walkable
tempo; 2. It tells a story through melodic and rhythmic sophistication; 3.
It has powerful emotional substance.
I'm familiar with Gotan and BFTC and I like them. Let's hold them up to the
light of the three criteria. (all IMHO, of course)...
1. "A consistent, walkable tempo" - yes, in general, I agree. They are
consistent and the tempo is walkable. But this criterion falls apart. It
is insufficient to define a genre because so much traditional tango music
for listening does not have a steady beat, while lots of music that has
nothing to do with tango or Argentine culture has a 'walkable' tempo**. The
concept of "walkable" is just too loosy-goosy. We've covered that topic in
the past and don't need to do it again. We are each comfortable with our
own level of 'literal' linkage between the movement and the music. What's
walkable to me may feel like a disaster to somebody else.
** I'm reminded of an inspired lyric by 'country' artist Alison Krause
('Broadway'): "It's been a steady pace, to keep my steps between these
cracks on Broadway and my stride in rhythm to the beat of 'Home Sweet
Home'". ...sweet music!
2. "A story told through melodic and rhythmic sophistication" -
Sophisticated to whom? I personally find the rhythms to be relatively
uninspiring. That is not to criticize, but let's compare them to the
rhythms of, for example, chacarara. Chacarara music has heart, and a subset
of it is used for dancing. The portion of the dance that is walked (not the
zapateo) has simple, measured steps. But the background rhythms in the
music are *wonderfully* complex. ...so much so that it can make those
simple walking steps feel syncopated as hell. Candombe, too, is a league
apart from the 'electronic' rhythms of Gotan and BFTC. Rhythmic
sophistication? Nnnnno.
OK, then, what about melody? Let's compare. Nobody's melodies stop me in
my tracks like Puccini's. I feel that Puccini's operatic arias are
sophisticated in their simplicity. In as much as they evoke such a
wonderful bouquet of powerful emotions, I would call them 'pure'. [However,
compared to, say, Wagner, Puccini's musical form and structure seem
relatively simple.] My personal reaction to Puccini's melodies is that they
are beautiful in both their simplicity and clarity. Now back to Gotan and
BFTC - I can't say that remixed, chopped up sound-bytes repeated in an
electronic rhythm track come off with any air of clarity. But ya wanna know
what DOES sound as pure as Puccini? Carlos Gardel singing Volver or El Dia
Que Mi Queras. Turn it up. It transcends the technical limitations of it's
sound reproduction. ...which brings me to criterion 3 - next message...
Frank Williams
Date: Wed, 3 Sep 2003 13:35:01 -0500
From: "Frank G. Williams" <frankw@MAIL.AHC.UMN.EDU>
Subject: Re: "Neo Tango" 2
3. "Powerful emotional substance"... Well, what can we say about such
matters of emotional relevancy?
I'm led to the conclusion, which I think is supportable, that tango music
for dance has *always* been a sub-set of the popular tango. It has always
catered to the dynamic sensibilities of bodies with it's particular
combination of energy and restraint. And historically, IMHO, tango music
for dance has been relatively restrained, emotionally, compared to (for lack
of a better term) 'performance' tango. Of course there are exceptions where
a large dose of talent was injected, like that of Osvaldo Pugliese. But I
think the ingredient of 'passion' has always been tempered in tangos for
dance.
But in thinking about adopting new material to express in movement - to me,
tango is not only intellectual abstraction. We each have our frame of
reference. I think tango is not something you can 'fuse' with other forms
without serious dilution, because tango is NOTHING without passion. Baby,
it's the *temperature* of dripping blood. It's the *taste* of somebody
else's sweat and the *softness* of their skin on your tongue. It's the
*literal ache* of bereavement. It is *compression* against your chest of
somebody's heart pounding and the force of their diaphragm as they breathe.
Passion in Gotan or BFTC? Please. Pinch yourself - hard. It's not
'tempered', it's GONE. When I can walk into Starbucks and hear Gardel sing
'Volver', then I'll consider their commercial endorsement (and marketing) as
a compliment. I don't want to sound negative - I think all artists deserve
exposure. But let's not lightly toss around phrases like "powerful
emotional substance". Pugliese and Piazzolla abstracted tango and kept it's
passion. Gotan and BFTC abstracted tango but lost it's passion. It's like
the latter have painted a lovely soft water color of the houses in la Boca.
How can THAT remind us of the smell of the river?! ;-)
Parting shots:
a. Dancers, like people in general, prefer that others (like musicians)
adapt to them.
b. I like Gotan, BFTC, and a lot of the other music that has been swept into
the pile called 'neo tango' - I play them mostly when I don't want to be
distracted. For me, Gotan and BFTC do not touch the heart. Not even close.
Gotan and BFTC are music for the (relaxed) brain.
c. I hope, for each of you (and pretty Sharna), that the literal realities
of tango in your own lives do not resonate with much pain. If the pain in
tango is left abstract then, OK, it's good that some of the passion will
also be abstract. Enjoy whatever music provides intellectual drive for your
kinesthetic 'needs'. Dancers love to move! Tango movement, also an
abstraction, is even beautiful performed in silence.
Finally, if you feel the tango in your heart - really deep in your heart -
then, my friend, un abrazo del Minneapolis and all my best - always.
Frank
Frank G. Williams, Ph.D.
University of Minnesota
612-625-6441
Department of Neuroscience
6-145 Jackson Hall
321 Church Street SE
Minneapolis, MN 55455
Department of Veterinary Pathobiology
205 Veterinary Science
1971 Commonwealth Ave.
St. Paul, MN 55108
Date: Wed, 3 Sep 2003 11:37:01 -0800
From: redfox@ALASKA.NET
Subject: Re: "Neo Tango"
Sharna did not publicize her article here on Tango-L. There must be a reason. If she wanted it to get onto tango-L, she could easily have done so. Someone on Tango-L published her website link to the list, not Sharna. This happened after I was included on a personal group message from Sharna, where she invited a select group of poeple to read the article on her site. She did NOT, I'm sure, intend for her article to be "discussed" on tango-L. I absolutely hate to see people's writing flamed out on tango-L when they didn't even put it there themselves. This is enough reason to stop this thread immediately.
Let's leave Sharna's article for what it is - a personal essay for those who are interested, not fodder for the tango-L shredding machine.
Dan
Date: Wed, 3 Sep 2003 15:25:37 -0700
From: Gerhard Hellemann <helleman@UCLA.EDU>
Subject: Re: "Neo Tango"
This is my first post to Tango-L , so first some introductions: I have been
following this group for about 8 months by reading the message archives,
and this is also for how long i have been trying to learn tango.
I have also read most of the archives back to 1998, and i am aware that the
topics of "what is tango", "what is not tango", "Is it ok to dance to
not-tango", "People have to dance to not-tango because the fidelity of
golden-age tango is just too low to make it enjoyable" have been adressed
several times.
I would still be grateful for any comments people have on this again. I
disagree with Dan when he ask the list to stop discussing this
topic ("This happened after I was included on a personal group message
from Sharna, where she invited a select group of poeple to read the article
on her site. She did NOT, I'm sure, intend for her article to be
"discussed" on tango-L. I absolutely hate to see people's writing flamed
out on tango-L when they didn't even put it there themselves. This is
enough reason to stop this thread immediately." redfox@alaska.net)
IMO Sharna intended this article to be read and thought about and ,yes,
discussed by anybody with internet access. She didn't distribute it to a
select group of people by e-mail, nor did she put it in a part of her
homepage that is not linked to the index page, she put it directly onto her
commercial(or at least "intended for the public" page. Its not like this is
a hidden subdirectory of a private page. So please, don't stop the thread.
I am intrigued by the fact that even in here the neo-tango doesn't
fit with the original front lines that were drawn in the old tango vs. new
tango discussions. The main complaint against new tango was always that it
lacks the steady beat, and is not concerned with the dancers.
The musicians are also clearly trying to use tango sensibilities, and it is
not as easy to claim that it is just not-tango.
At the milongas here you tend to get usually one tanda of neo-tango (mostly
gotan project), and in my experience it is a very different mood from
classic tango. I would describe it as a slow-milonga feel. There is more
energy. There is still the passion of tango, but instead of being quietly
smoldering it is more outward, flaming. I feel my partner differently, more
physically, and for me it also changes the lead-follow dynamic a bit -
where i feel like trying to meld with my partner into one in c.t. i feel
like i am actually trying to create the opposite in n.t.: I want to enjoy
my partners energy as a seperate person that collaborates(or not :) ) with
me in creating the dance.
Gerhard
Date: Thu, 4 Sep 2003 16:06:34 -0300
From: Alberto Gesualdi <clambat2001@YAHOO.COM.AR>
Subject: Neo tango
The Bajo Fondo Tango Club , has just been awarded a latin Grammy award, into the cathegory "best album instrumental pop " .
Maybe the problem to use greek word neo as "new" but keeping "tango" is a conflict of this line of music.
To say that tango is "old" or is "new", is to narrow , out from all the possibilities of qualification of this kind of music, to a only one criteria, which is at least, very doubtful as standard.
It seems to be also a group of die hard tango fans , that refuse to acept musical experiences as this group, Gotan Project , and many other groups that intend to create music.
The fact is tango music evolved through the years , taking what it needed and discarding what it was not necessary, on their own.
It is very uncertain to use temporal qualifications for this music. Recordings from the 304s have musical innovations that today are still to be understood.
De Caro introduced his violin with an amplifier , that make this instrument unique for tango music, those years.
"Old" musicians played with the instruments and possibilities they have. There were no dolby system, and also not all the paraphernalia that you have at a recording/mixing studio this days .
Recordings were needed to be one and again until the quality was aceptable, there were no post edition facilities .
Now there are reprintings being made , from takes that the artists refused to approve. This is something bad , as it may be the alteration of the original music .
You can play Che bandoneon , using pans and garbage covers if you want , but it will still be the original melody played with different instruments.
It is extremely difficult to create "new" music , without the temptation to borrow some lines from the "old" music.
This situation does not ends here, it is just opening , I hope it would be something good in the end
Warm regards
Alberto Gesualdi
Buenos Aires
Usuario: yahoo; contraseqa: yahoo
Desde Buenos Aires: 4004-1010
Mas ciudades: clic aqum.
