1083 Pet Peeves
Date: Wed, 5 Mar 2003 13:37:40 -0800
From: Rick FromPdx <bugs1959bunny@YAHOO.COM>
Subject: Re: Pet Peeves
My pet peeves are: sound quality & snootiness.
I'm sure this has been rehased on this list before, "if women did the asking for dances".
A friend told me last night she looks for someone that can lead what they know well, are considerate & connect well with her.
R
Biblical statements writted by children:
* One of the opossums was St. Matthew who was also a taximan.
* St. Paul cavorted to Christianity. He preached holy acrimony, which is another name for marriage.
* A Christian should have only one spouse. This is called monotony.
Date: Thu, 17 Jan 2008 17:27:14 -0800 (PST)
From: Tango For Her <tangopeer@yahoo.com>
Subject: [Tango-L] Two of My Teaching Pet Peeves
Someone wrote to me:
> "keep his left foot in(one of the biggest problems >
out there that teachers really don't fix in most
> classes!)
> and
> having the follower take a smaller back
> step than all those teachers out there LOVE to
> teach so that they wouldn't separate from their
> young leaders."
>
> Are you refering to the cross ???
Not necessarily. No.
Teachers spend a lot of time teaching beginning
leaders how to walk and go to the cross. They spend a
lot of time teaching followers to extend their leg, in
doing a backstep.
But, I have a few pet peeves about a lot of tango
teachers.
Look. You want your beginning leaders and
intermediate leaders to stop knocking their followers
off balance? Find ways to teach them to have their
left foot step in front of them rather than off to the
left. They ALL do it! STOP THEM! Why go on with
your classes if you are going to keep letting them
step slightly off to the left with their left foot?
1. It puts their follower off balance.
2. It creates confusion between a front step and a
side step or an ocho. If I was a young follower, I'd
go nuts! It's so easy to fix and it's one of the
biggest reasons for confusion!
Someone, PLEASE, tell me why soooo many teachers teach
young followers to s-s-s-s-stretch their leg out,
really far, in a backstep!!! Is that the only way to
teach them to have a straight knee and a beautiful
leg? Can't they have it with a shorter backstep like,
say, in the same county?
What if their young leader leads a 12" step and they
step into the next county? NEITHER of them knows how
to fix that awful feeling of having absolutely no
connection. Bounce! Bounce! Bounce!
It's sooo easy to fix!!!!
Sorry, everyone! Those two, and a few others, drive
me nuts! Almost every teacher that I have seen lets
those things go! They are a couple of the BIGGEST
reasons for confusion!
Whew .... I'm okay. Now.
Looking for last minute shopping deals?
Date: Thu, 17 Jan 2008 19:13:09 -0800 (PST)
From: Mario <sopelote@yahoo.com>
Subject: [Tango-L] Two of My Teaching Pet Peeves
To: tango-l@mit.edu
Hmmm, I'm always trying to get further outside on my left especially when in close embrace. Is this my problem?
Can you be a little more descriptive? Certainly walking to the cross, one has to do this...is this wrong at some times? when? Is it a matter of an inch or two? thanks
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Date: Thu, 17 Jan 2008 22:57:14 -0500
From: "Michael" <tangomaniac@cavtel.net>
Subject: Re: [Tango-L] Two of My Teaching Pet Peeves
Cc: Michael <tangomaniac@cavtel.net>
First, if the lead is for a small step, the follower should take a small step. If the leader's frame is weak and doesn't communicate the size of the step, that's the leader's fault.
Second, I don't know how far is far for a back step. The woman shouldn't step so far it would cause her hips to turn away from the leader. The leader has to feel how far the woman is stepping backward. An alternative way of looking at stepping backward is to move the leg backward from the hip. If you move the foot first, there will be a "popping" at the knee as the foot extends.
I'm not sure teachers are signalling for the size of the step but more for HOW to reach backward from the hip. If the leader leads a small step, the woman should still reach backward from the hip and straighten the leg based on the size of the step that is lead. The leg should be straightened before the woman steps on it.
Michael Ditkoff
Washington, DC
"Neither snow, nor rain, nor heat, nor gloom of night stays Greyhound from the swift completion of its schedule to New York on Saturday.
I'd rather be dancing Argentine Tango
----- Original Message -----
From: "Tango For Her" <tangopeer@yahoo.com>
Sent: Thursday, January 17, 2008 8:27 PM
Subject: [Tango-L] Two of My Teaching Pet Peeves
Someone wrote to me:
They spend a lot of time teaching followers to extend their leg, in
doing a backstep.
Someone, PLEASE, tell me why soooo many teachers teach
young followers to s-s-s-s-stretch their leg out,
really far, in a backstep!!!
Date: Thu, 17 Jan 2008 20:32:48 -0800 (PST)
From: Tango For Her <tangopeer@yahoo.com>
Subject: [Tango-L] Followers Large BackStep - Was Pet Peeves
I wasn't clear when I said this:
>
> Someone wrote to me:
>
> They spend a lot of time teaching followers to
> extend their leg, in
> doing a backstep.
>
> Someone, PLEASE, tell me why soooo many teachers
> teach
> young followers to s-s-s-s-stretch their leg out,
> really far, in a backstep!!!
>
What I meant to say is ...
I see plenty of newer followers take huge backsteps
when they are not led. When I ask why they are doing
that they say, "That's what my teacher said to do."
Yes, they should learn to have a beautifully straight
leg. But, they should know, right up front, to also
do that when a short step is led. Otherwise, newer
leaders will really have their hands full.
To tell you the truth, I have danced with teachers who
look great dancing, but, when I lead small steps, they
don't take small steps. I guess they want to dance
alone! :o\ We don't dance very often!
Be a better friend, newshound, and
Date: Fri, 18 Jan 2008 15:03:46 +0900
From: "Astrid" <astrid@ruby.plala.or.jp>
Subject: Re: [Tango-L] Two of My Teaching Pet Peeves
To: "Mario" <sopelote@yahoo.com>, <tango-l@mit.edu>
> Hmmm, I'm always trying to get further outside on my left especially when
> in close embrace. Is this my problem?
No, you are not alone. A lot of men do this, and let me tell you, the
further left you go, the more uncomfortable it gets for the woman.
Especially if you turn the right side of her body at an angle to you. It
means, she has to walk while constantly having her back twisted into an
unnatural angle. Lasrt time I danced with a Japanese tango teacher who took
this to such an extreme that he looked like he would have almost prefered to
dance behind me. Why do guys do this?
> Can you be a little more descriptive? Certainly walking to the cross,
> one has to do this...is this wrong at some times? when? Is it a matter of
> an inch or two? thanks
>
>
>
> Looking for last minute shopping deals? Find them fast with Yahoo!
> Search.
>
Date: Fri, 18 Jan 2008 11:52 +0000 (GMT Standard Time)
From: "Chris, UK" <tl2@chrisjj.com>
Subject: Re: [Tango-L] Two of My Teaching Pet Peeves
Cc: tl2@chrisjj.com
TFH wrote of his two pet teaching peeves:
> Find ways to teach them to have their left foot step in front of them
> rather than off to the left. They ALL do it! STOP THEM!
That's common hereabouts in segregated class pupils. The guy is going left
to avoid kicking the girl's foot. Which he's not yet moved because
actually he hasn't learned to lead. Guys: spend 1hr with a good leader.
> Someone, PLEASE, tell me why soooo many teachers teach
> young followers to s-s-s-s-stretch their leg out,
> really far, in a backstep!!!
Same again. The guy hasn't learned to lead her to stretch, and this
teacher 'fixes' /her/ the only way he knows. This breaks the connection so
neither guy or girl can find the natural solution themselves.
> Is that the only way to teach them to have a straight knee and a
> beautiful leg? Can't they have it with a shorter backstep
They sure can. Girls: ignore teacher. Guys: spend 1hr with a good leader.
> NEITHER of them knows how to fix that awful feeling of having
> absolutely no connection. Bounce! Bounce! Bounce!
Girls: spend 1hr with a good leader. Guys: spend 1hr with a good leader.
> Almost every teacher that I have seen lets those things go!
The teacher has no choice. These dysfunctions are inevitable consequences
of the class teahcing model that couples non-dancers with non-dancers.
--
Chris
Date: Fri, 18 Jan 2008 06:54:52 -0800 (PST)
From: Tango For Her <tangopeer@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Tango-L] Two of My Teaching Pet Peeves
--- "Chris, UK" <tl2@chrisjj.com> wrote:
> TFH wrote of his two pet teaching peeves:
>
> > Find ways to teach them to have their left foot
> step in front of them
> > rather than off to the left. They ALL do it!
> STOP THEM!
>
> That's common hereabouts in segregated class pupils.
> The guy is going left
> to avoid kicking the girl's foot. Which he's not yet
> moved because
> actually he hasn't learned to lead. Guys: spend 1hr
> with a good leader.
Sure. But, that?s taking the responsibility away from
the teachers!
Teachers, when you see 3 leaders in your class
stepping off to the left, stop the class, point it
out, show them how to correct it and continue with
your steadfast gameplan.
===
>
> > Someone, PLEASE, tell me why soooo many teachers
> teach
> > young followers to s-s-s-s-stretch their leg out,
> > really far, in a backstep!!!
>
> Same again. The guy hasn't learned to lead her to
> stretch, and this
> teacher 'fixes' /her/ the only way he knows. This
> breaks the connection so
> neither guy or girl can find the natural solution
> themselves.
>
There IS a solution! Teachers, when you teach about
straightening the knee in the backstep, also, teach it
with a short step. They are NOT being taught this!
===
> > Is that the only way to teach them to have a
> straight knee and a
> > beautiful leg? Can't they have it with a shorter
> backstep
>
> They sure can. Girls: ignore teacher. Guys: spend
> 1hr with a good leader.
>
Instead, Girls, ask your teacher about straightening
your leg during a short backstep. Make your teachers
earn their money!
===
> > NEITHER of them knows how to fix that awful
> feeling of having
> > absolutely no connection. Bounce! Bounce!
> Bounce!
>
> Girls: spend 1hr with a good leader. Guys: spend 1hr
> with a good leader.
>
> > Almost every teacher that I have seen lets those
> things go!
>
> The teacher has no choice. These dysfunctions are
> inevitable consequences
> of the class teahcing model that couples non-dancers
> with non-dancers.
>
Teachers do have a choice! When you see a number of
people doing a certain thing wrong, stop the class,
point it out, show them the correct way, and continue
the class.
Never miss a thing. Make Yahoo your home page.
Date: Fri, 18 Jan 2008 10:08:55 -0500
From: Carol Shepherd <arborlaw@comcast.net>
Subject: Re: [Tango-L] Two of My Teaching Pet Peeves
To: Astrid <astrid@ruby.plala.or.jp>
Cc: tango-l@mit.edu
Bravo, Astrid. I have been having this problem for years and could not
exactly pinpoint why my lower back was in so much pain from dancing with
certain people. Thanks
CS
Astrid wrote:
>> Hmmm, I'm always trying to get further outside on my left especially when
>> in close embrace. Is this my problem?
>
> No, you are not alone. A lot of men do this, and let me tell you, the
> further left you go, the more uncomfortable it gets for the woman.
> Especially if you turn the right side of her body at an angle to you. It
> means, she has to walk while constantly having her back twisted into an
> unnatural angle. Lasrt time I danced with a Japanese tango teacher who took
> this to such an extreme that he looked like he would have almost prefered to
> dance behind me. Why do guys do this?
>
>> Can you be a little more descriptive? Certainly walking to the cross,
>> one has to do this...is this wrong at some times? when? Is it a matter of
>> an inch or two? thanks
>>
>>
>>
>
--
Carol Ruth Shepherd
Arborlaw PLC
Ann Arbor MI USA
734 668 4646 v 734 786 1241 f
Arborlaw - a legal blog for entrepreneurs and small business
https://arborlaw.com
Date: Fri, 18 Jan 2008 10:49:22 -0700
From: Tom Stermitz <stermitz@tango.org>
Subject: Re: [Tango-L] Two of My Teaching Pet Peeves
To: Tango-L <tango-L@mit.edu>
I share your two pet peeves (three if you think about it):
- How to walk in a straight line.
- How not to step on her feet. How not to get stepped on.
- How to walk to the cross without going too far outside.
These are real issues for all newcomers to dance, and it is
understandable that it would take some effort to resolve them.
Teachers can and should figure out how to speed the learning process
and correct bad technique earlier on. Sensible body mechanics are
often compromised by stylistic ideas, which can even lead to injury.
The followers back and SI joint is a weak point.
First, to sympathize with the newcomer to tango:
- The new leader is really afraid of stepping on her, so he
typically overcompensates.
- Walking backwards gracefully is difficult and certainly much more
unfamiliar than walking forward.
- Spiraling movements (moving outside to the left of her) are much
harder to do than walking straight forward
- He sees the teacher's movement, but has a tendency to exaggerate it.
WALKING IN A STRAIGHT LINE
As your body moves forward, your foot should land under your center of
balance. If she is in front of you, then you are also stepping under
her center of balance. This is true by stupid definition: It is called
"walking without falling over". But, there is a real reason why
leaders have difficulty with balance and walking in a straight line.
He is trying to avoid stepping on her, and compensates by moving his
feet to either side. On the follower's side, she tries to overstep
backwards to get her feet out of the way.
Solutions:
Leader needs to move forward in a natural "side walk" stride. A
purposeful, upright, bold stride of the leader helps everything: Land
heel-ball, end with the weight transfer with his "hips, heart and
head" over the ball of the foot. This keeps his posture forward,
upright and on balance. The follower's connection to his body moves
her backward, and her feet can "naturally" float to catch her body.
Landing on the ball of the foot is a stylistic treatment, that is a
direct contradiction of 20 or 40 years of daily walking. Maybe it's
desirable for some versions of tango (stage, for example), but for
regular social dancing it is so much better to work with normal,
natural movements. If you teach a class of beginners to lead with the
toes or ball of the foot, you will produce a class of guys worried
about their feet and mincing across the room instead of moving their
bodies boldly.
WALKING BACKWARDS GRACEFULLY
Walking "naturally" backwards means that the ACTIVE leg is the
supporting leg, the one that pushes her body through space, and the
FLOATING leg stretches downwards and back, rather than reaching.
Reaching and engaging the butt muscles, digs into her SI joints. The
recently popular, "culo alegre" style of arching the lower back makes
this much worse. Maybe the 20-year old ballerina is not yet injured,
but for normal women, the wear and tear on the back is really harmful.
Consider also that pregnancy loosens a woman's joints, and has a
specific impact on the SI joints.
There is a simple way to address this: Keep your heels downward,
almost grazing the floor. A gently straight leg comes from keeping a
soft butt, stretching the inner thigh, psoas and lower tummy, and
stretching the achilles.
Quick survey: How many women have sore backs after a workshop weekend?
- Do you reach back or stretch downwards?
- Is your butt soft or tight muscles?
- Are you trying to take big steps?
- How's your core support?
- Is your belly-button pulled toward your backbone?
- Is your heel pointed downward?
Secondly, reaching way back, away from the leader disconnects the
woman's leg from herself. She is guessing how long the stride will be,
rather than matching the float of her leg to his forward movement. The
most connected strides come when the leader's and follower's legs
match speed and distance. One of the best exercises I have to discover
this is for the follower to "almost brush his thigh" as it comes
forward. If she can slow down her float to match his tempo, she will
always be out of his way, and never out of connection, both internal
and with him.
SPIRALING AND WALKING OUTSIDE (TO THE CROSS)
My pet peeve is leaders who over-lead the cross. They walk way outside
and their movement shouts: I'M GOING TO CROSS NOOOOWWWW!". That
habituates the followers to gross, even grotesquely exaggerated
movements.
I know. It is popular to teach that he should lead her cross with a
spiral. I prefer leading the cross mostly with the axis. I think of
the leader FOLLOWING her with his spiral as he walks outside, leading
the cross with the axis shifting slightly diagonal, and then un-
spiraling to follow her as she moves to the cross.
Again, sympathy for the beginner is important. Walking in a straight
line is much easier than rotational movements: spiraling, pivoting and
ochos. Walking to the cross introduces two difficult things at once:
walking off to the side which has to be coordinated with a spiraling
movement. The beginner visually picks it up the teacher's movement,
but then exaggerates it when they try to replicate it.
My solution is to keep the walk to the cross much more gentle, more
linear and with less twisting.
On Jan 17, 2008, at 6:27 PM, Tango For Her wrote:
> Someone wrote to me:
>
>> "keep his left foot in (one of the biggest problems out
>> there that teachers really don't fix in mostclasses!)
>> and having the follower take a smaller back
>> step than all those teachers out there LOVE to
>> teach so that they wouldn't separate from their
>> young leaders."
>>
>> Are you refering to the cross ???
>
> Not necessarily. No.
>
> Teachers spend a lot of time teaching beginning
> leaders how to walk and go to the cross. They spend a
> lot of time teaching followers to extend their leg, in
> doing a backstep.
>
> But, I have a few pet peeves about a lot of tango
> teachers.
>
> Look. You want your beginning leaders and
> intermediate leaders to stop knocking their followers
> off balance? Find ways to teach them to have their
> left foot step in front of them rather than off to the
> left. They ALL do it! STOP THEM! Why go on with
> your classes if you are going to keep letting them
> step slightly off to the left with their left foot?
> ...
> Someone, PLEASE, tell me why soooo many teachers teach
> young followers to s-s-s-s-stretch their leg out,
> really far, in a backstep!!! Is that the only way to
> teach them to have a straight knee and a beautiful
> leg? Can't they have it with a shorter backstep like,
> say, in the same county?
> ...
> Sorry, everyone! Those two, and a few others, drive
> me nuts! Almost every teacher that I have seen lets
> those things go! They are a couple of the BIGGEST
> reasons for confusion!
>
> Whew .... I'm okay. Now.
Date: Fri, 18 Jan 2008 11:39:43 -0700
From: Tom Stermitz <stermitz@tango.org>
Subject: Re: [Tango-L] Two of My Teaching Pet Peeves
To: Tango-L <tango-L@mit.edu>
I share your two pet peeves (three if you think about it):
- How to walk in a straight line.
- How not to step on her feet. How not to get stepped on.
- How to walk to the cross without going too far outside.
These are real issues for all newcomers to dance, and it is
understandable that it would take some effort to resolve them.
Teachers can and should figure out how to speed the learning process
and correct bad technique earlier on. Sensible body mechanics are
often compromised by stylistic ideas, which can even lead to injury.
The followers back and SI joint is a weak point.
First, to sympathize with the newcomer to tango:
- The new leader is really afraid of stepping on her, so he typically
overcompensates.
- Walking backwards gracefully is difficult and certainly much more
unfamiliar than walking forward.
- Spiraling movements (moving outside to the left of her) are much
harder to do than walking straight forward
- He sees the teacher's movement, but has a tendency to exaggerate it.
(Part 1)
SPIRALING AND WALKING OUTSIDE (TO THE CROSS)
My pet peeve is leaders who over-lead the cross. They walk way outside
and their movement shouts: I'M GOING TO CROSS NOOOOWWWW!". That
habituates the followers to gross, even grotesquely exaggerated
movements.
I know. It is popular to teach that he should lead her cross with a
spiral. I prefer leading the cross mostly with the axis. I think of
the leader FOLLOWING her with his spiral as he walks outside, leading
the cross with the axis shifting slightly diagonal, and then un-
spiraling to follow her as she moves to the cross.
Again, sympathy for the beginner is important. Walking in a straight
line is much easier than rotational movements: spiraling, pivoting and
ochos. Walking to the cross introduces two difficult things at once:
walking off to the side which has to be coordinated with a spiraling
movement. The beginner visually picks it up the teacher's movement,
but then exaggerates it when they try to replicate it.
My solution is to keep the walk to the cross much more gentle, more
linear and with less twisting.
On Jan 17, 2008, at 6:27 PM, Tango For Her wrote:
> But, I have a few pet peeves about a lot of tango
> teachers.
>
> Look. You want your beginning leaders and
> intermediate leaders to stop knocking their followers
> off balance? Find ways to teach them to have their
> left foot step in front of them rather than off to the
> left. They ALL do it! STOP THEM! Why go on with
> your classes if you are going to keep letting them
> step slightly off to the left with their left foot?
> ...
> Someone, PLEASE, tell me why soooo many teachers teach
> young followers to s-s-s-s-stretch their leg out,
> really far, in a backstep!!! Is that the only way to
> teach them to have a straight knee and a beautiful
> leg? Can't they have it with a shorter backstep like,
> say, in the same county?
> ...
> Whew .... I'm okay. Now.
Tom Stermitz
https://www.tango.org
Denver, CO 80207
Date: Fri, 18 Jan 2008 11:40:09 -0700
From: Tom Stermitz <Stermitz@tango.org>
Subject: Re: [Tango-L] Two of My Teaching Pet Peeves
To: Tango-L <tango-L@mit.edu>
I share your two pet peeves (three if you think about it):
- How to walk in a straight line.
- How not to step on her feet. How not to get stepped on.
- How to walk to the cross without going too far outside.
(part 2)
WALKING IN A STRAIGHT LINE
As your body moves forward, your foot should land under your center of
balance. If she is in front of you, then you are also stepping under
her center of balance. This is true by stupid definition: It is called
"walking without falling over". But, there is a real reason why
leaders have difficulty with balance and walking in a straight line.
He is trying to avoid stepping on her, and compensates by moving his
feet to either side. On the follower's side, she tries to overstep
backwards to get her feet out of the way.
Solutions:
Leader needs to move forward in a natural "side walk" stride. A
purposeful, upright, bold stride of the leader helps everything: Land
heel-ball, end with the weight transfer with his "hips, heart and
head" over the ball of the foot. This keeps his posture forward,
upright and on balance. The follower's connection to his body moves
her backward, and her feet can "naturally" float to catch her body.
Landing on the ball of the foot is a stylistic treatment, that is a
direct contradiction of 20 or 40 years of daily walking. Maybe it's
desirable for some versions of tango (stage, for example), but for
regular social dancing it is so much better to work with normal,
natural movements. If you teach a class of beginners to lead with the
toes or ball of the foot, you will produce a class of guys worried
about their feet and mincing across the room instead of moving their
bodies boldly.
WALKING BACKWARDS GRACEFULLY
Walking "naturally" backwards means that the ACTIVE leg is the
supporting leg, the one that pushes her body through space, and the
FLOATING leg stretches downwards and back, rather than reaching.
Reaching and engaging the butt muscles, digs into her SI joints. The
recently popular, "culo alegre" style of arching the lower back makes
this much worse. Maybe the 20-year old ballerina is not yet injured,
but for normal women, the wear and tear on the back is really harmful.
Consider also that pregnancy loosens a woman's joints, and has a
specific impact on the SI joints.
There is a simple way to address this: Keep your heels downward,
almost grazing the floor. A gently straight leg comes from keeping a
soft butt, stretching the inner thigh, psoas and lower tummy, and
stretching the achilles.
Quick survey: How many women have sore backs after a workshop weekend?
- Do you reach back or stretch downwards?
- Is your butt soft or tight muscles?
- Are you trying to take big steps?
- How's your core support?
- Is your belly-button pulled toward your backbone?
- Is your heel pointed downward?
Secondly, reaching way back, away from the leader disconnects the
woman's leg from herself. She is guessing how long the stride will be,
rather than matching the float of her leg to his forward movement. The
most connected strides come when the leader's and follower's legs
match speed and distance. One of the best exercises I have to discover
this is for the follower to "almost brush his thigh" as it comes
forward. If she can slow down her float to match his tempo, she will
always be out of his way, and never out of connection, both internal
and with him.
Tom Stermitz
https://www.tango.org
Denver, CO 80207
Date: Fri, 18 Jan 2008 10:57:37 -0800 (PST)
From: Mario <sopelote@yahoo.com>
Subject: [Tango-L] Two of My Teaching Pet Peeves
To: tango-l@mit.edu
hello, I'm guessing this is Mel. You did me a giant favor by posting that last one on walking, etc. Mil gracias! after one minute of heel toe instead of balls of feet walking, my wife said that I was walking much better.. wow, thanks.
Looking for last minute shopping deals? Find them fast with Yahoo! Search.
Date: Fri, 18 Jan 2008 14:19:37 -0800 (PST)
From: "Trini y Sean (PATangoS)" <patangos@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Tango-L] Two of My Teaching Pet Peeves
Unfortunately, I don't have time to read all of the posts
that popped up today while I was at work. And I probably
won't until after I return from Ann Arbor. So, please
excuse me if I end up repeating something someone else has
already mentioned.
--- Tango For Her <tangopeer@yahoo.com> wrote:
> Someone, PLEASE, tell me why soooo many teachers teach
> young followers to s-s-s-s-stretch their leg out,
> really far, in a backstep!!! Is that the only way to
> teach them to have a straight knee and a beautiful
> leg? Can't they have it with a shorter backstep like,
> say, in the same county?
Here teachers confuse length of the body with length along
the floor. If a follower learns to use the length of her
body, a properly-sized step will follow. Followers tend to
take small steps if they initiate the back step with their
knee or the middle of the thigh. If you teach them to step
where the leg rotates in the hip socket. This fixes a lot
of the problem.
Trini de Pittsburgh
PATangoS - Pittsburgh Argentine Tango Society
Our Mission: To make Argentine Tango Pittsburgh?s most popular social dance!
https://patangos.home.comcast.net/
Be a better friend, newshound, and
Date: Sat, 19 Jan 2008 10:48:26 +1000
From: "Anton Stanley" <antonst@alidas.com.au>
Subject: Re: [Tango-L] Two of My Teaching Pet Peeves
<00052DAF04B2EA4B925351AA0DE08CB70EF3FB@stancosbs1.stanco.local>
In response to the below posts, could someone put me straight on the
trend to hold the follower to the right side of the leader. from my very
first lesson in Tango, it was insisted upon that I keep the follower in
front of me. I found that difficult after years of Ballroom. Even today,
my teachers insist that the correct position to hold the follower is in
front. Any comments please?
Anton
(Bravo, Astrid. I have been having this problem for years and could not
exactly pinpoint why my lower back was in so much pain from dancing with
certain people. Thanks Carol
CS
Astrid wrote:
>> Hmmm, I'm always trying to get further outside on my left especially
>> when
>> in close embrace. Is this my problem?
>
> No, you are not alone. A lot of men do this, and let me tell you, the
> further left you go, the more uncomfortable it gets for the woman.
> Especially if you turn the right side of her body at an angle to you.
It
> means, she has to walk while constantly having her back twisted into
an
> unnatural angle. Lasrt time I danced with a Japanese tango teacher who
took
> this to such an extreme that he looked like he would have almost
prefered to
> dance behind me. Why do guys do this?)
From: "Anton Stanley" <antonst@alidas.com.au>
Subject: Re: [Tango-L] Two of My Teaching Pet Peeves
In response to the below posts, could someone put me straight on the
trend to hold the follower to the right side of the leader. from my very
first lesson in Tango, it was insisted upon that I keep the follower in
front of me. I found that difficult after years of Ballroom. Even today,
my teachers insist that the correct position to hold the follower is in
front. Any comments please?
Anton
Date: Sat, 19 Jan 2008 08:11:17 +0200
From: "Krasimir Stoyanov" <krasimir@krasimir.com>
Subject: Re: [Tango-L] Two of My Teaching Pet Peeves
Both are possible, and both are correct. Most Argentineans dance with the
follower slightly to the right - but, in my experience, not many are the
people that have the necessary posture and dissociation to perform correctly
in this position.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Anton Stanley" <antonst@alidas.com.au>
Sent: Saturday, January 19, 2008 2:48 AM
Subject: Re: [Tango-L] Two of My Teaching Pet Peeves
> In response to the below posts, could someone put me straight on the
> trend to hold the follower to the right side of the leader. from my very
> first lesson in Tango, it was insisted upon that I keep the follower in
> front of me. I found that difficult after years of Ballroom. Even today,
> my teachers insist that the correct position to hold the follower is in
> front. Any comments please?
>
> Anton
>
>
>
> (Bravo, Astrid. I have been having this problem for years and could not
>
> exactly pinpoint why my lower back was in so much pain from dancing with
>
> certain people. Thanks Carol
>
> CS
>
> Astrid wrote:
>>> Hmmm, I'm always trying to get further outside on my left especially
>>> when
>>> in close embrace. Is this my problem?
>>
>> No, you are not alone. A lot of men do this, and let me tell you, the
>> further left you go, the more uncomfortable it gets for the woman.
>> Especially if you turn the right side of her body at an angle to you.
> It
>> means, she has to walk while constantly having her back twisted into
> an
>> unnatural angle. Lasrt time I danced with a Japanese tango teacher who
> took
>> this to such an extreme that he looked like he would have almost
> prefered to
>> dance behind me. Why do guys do this?)
>
Date: Thu, 09 Apr 2009 12:57:24 -0400
From: tangomarty@aol.com
Subject: [Tango-L] alternate names for milongas, and pet peeves
To: tango-l@mit.edu
In NYC there are two major locations where alternative music and/or nuevo styles are predominant:
One is the Wednesday and some?Saturdays?Tango Cafe: Alternative Music Milonga , clearly labeled as such on newyorktango.com.??The other is?the?Saturday?Practilonga, where you seem to have a choice of practicing and stoppping toward the center of the room, or keeping a line of dance in the outer periphery of the room.?? The rest of the milongas in NYC have varied ratios of traditional and modern dancers, and after a while you get to know which one has higher percentages of which. (If you are visiting,?ask a local tanguero).??More open moves are usually reserved for very late into the night, when there is space. ??However, even so armed with information, there is no guarantee you wont come across the?occasional?idiot?road-raging real estate hog, with a high?flying boleo partner, ?at a traditional crowded milonga.? ?Many times?the?worst offenders?are so called "teachers" of tango,?trying to impress students.??That really irks me, as they?clearly know what they are doing to the o
ther dancers.? I cut more slack to the intermediate who just discovered some leg entanglement and?stops during a fast moving?vals right in front of me to set it up.? At least I can move around them, knowing they will be comatose and stationary for the foreseeable future.?But the "pro", thats another story, a real live wire,?you have no way of knowing which way he will dart like a soccer player running through a pack. Your best strategy then is for the leader to put his??back to them and protect the?follower.? But I am not sure of the etiquette in such a situation if the leader is a woman and the follower is a man.?
