2872  "True Tango"

Date: Thu, 7 Oct 2004 01:47:11 -0500
From: Michael Figart II <michaelfigart@YAHOO.COM>
Subject: "True Tango"

Hello List,



Youch, I knew it was coming, I went to Teo's (Ted Bartek's), website two
weeks ago and checked it out. The first thing I noticed was that I
danced with his wife in Denver over Labor Day weekend and was impressed
with her highly polished skill at following my simple Argentine Tango
Milonguero. I say simple, because I don't do ganchos, or enrosques, or
any of those other fancy things. I do only a couple of secadas, amagues,
and I love the walk, the simple turns, the cortada; simple moves
combined into many different combinations, any of which can be changed
at a moments notice to accomodate crowded dance floors. Marsha, thanks
for the dances; and since I doubt there's a whole lot of tango in
Gainesville, I assume that Teo must be a pretty good leader of what I
(and others), call Argentine Tango Milonguero.



I told Teo he'd be in trouble for talking about "true" tango, and I also
suggested he substitute "milonguero" for "salon" in his article. Teo
used the word "salon" as people do in Buenos Aires, whereas here in the
U.S., he really is talking about what we refer to as "milonguero tango".



I've been to Buenos Aires, I've danced in the milongas. I've met Pichi
on several occasions, and I'll admit that she and I have differences of
opinion, but I have the utmost respect for her and her love of
"milonguero tango", (she would say "the milongueros).

For Pichi, and Buenos Aires in general, a "milonguero" is one who lives
for tango, who goes to milongas 10 or 12 times a week, one for whom
tango has become a way of living, of surviving, and making it through
the next day, no matter what the current, oppressive political and
economic climate. We Americans have no real clue what the Argentines
have gone through for the last fifty years, and how it has influenced
their life, their culture, their dance.



For me, here in the US, a milonguero is one who dances to impress nobody
but his partner. He dances, feeling the music, and the heartbeat of his
partner......see more below!



Pichi saw something she liked in the article written by Ted Bartek, and
I did too, even though I tried to warn him!!! Is that any reason to jump
all over Pichi, and insult her in such an ungentle manner? And if you
disagree with Teo, why can't you just tell him why you disagree without
such disparaging and insulting comments?



To _______, we are sick of your acidic sarcasm just for the sake of
acidic sarcasm. Be constructive if you want to participate in this list.



Cella, thank you for your opinion; you definitely touched some nerves
that needed touching!



Konsantin; very astute observation! True versus new! No, I don't ascribe
to the "true" theory. Even the old "milongueros" in Buenos Aires each
have their own "style". Konstantin wrote <<<<<I think the substance
involves the charge that the new tango is divorced from the music and
the partnership (to different extents), and that it is not a strictly
improvisational dance anymore in that some or a lot of the
steps/sequences cannot be reliably led to a person who has no prior
knowledge of them. I would love people to address that instead of trying
to insult the milongueros or the person that posted the link to the
article.>>>>>Yes, this is the substance of the argument, I believe. And
yes, I think that "new", or "salon", while not divorced necessarily from
the music, or even the partnership, does divorce itself from the
connection, becomes more of an athletic pursuit, more akin to ballet.
It's very beautiful to watch when done well, and looks great, and the
dancers are to be admired for their skill, BUT, I've never seen the
follower giggling with happiness, or overcome with awe at the intimacy
of the lead, or even crying at the power of the mutual experience. This
is my definition of the "true" tango; when a leader and follower can
connect with each other, and the music, and the line of dance, in such a
manner that the experience blocks out everything but the ecstasy of two
souls in tune and entwined..........this is the true tango. If a couple
dancing "new", or "salon", or "nuevo", or "stage", or "fantasia", "or
club-style", or whatever, can experience this, and not kick me while
doing it, more power to them! But I've never seen it, and my experience,
and the feedback of my followers seems to indicate this doesn't exist.
Maybe I'm wrong. To me, the "true" tango can exist only when I immerse
myself in the music, and think only of my partner's happiness and
comfort. Every move I make is made only to enrich my partner's ecstasy
in our dance. To make her feel protected, comforted, happy, and her
every move effortless.



What do you think, followers? I'd be very interested in hearing what you
think about this subject. Can you experience this "nirvana" while
dancing salon, or open? Or does it require a sternum to sternum
"milonguero" embrace? (not to be confused with a "salon v-type" close
embrace).



And yes, list, as Konstantin said, address the issues instead of
insulting the messenger.



Jay Rabe; yes, you're very right. All teachers have something to teach,
and I can learn something from all of them, no matter what, but, I've
taken workshops from all of the biggest names, and they are too crowded
to get more than five steps into their fifteen step combination. And
with forty people in there, there's no individual help from the teacher.
And I'm not going to pay $140 for privates. Give me the small classes,
with teachers who concentrate on technique.



Give me teachers of simple milonguero technique, and a follower who will
wait, and some good DiSarli; that's all I'll ever need. When we finish
the last song of the tanda, and my follower is giggling (milonga), or
ecstatically happy (waltz), or still hanging on wanting another tanda of
tango; then I'm happy.



Jenkins; yeah; we can tell you are in distress. You offer nothing but
sarcastic attacks with no knowledgeable debate. Should you like to
contribute to this list, we'd like to have some constructive opinion
related to the conversation at hand. Your petty, defensive attitude is
most unbecoming of a tanguero, and yes, you should probably be worried
(am I a real man?) I won't answer whether you should qualify for
purgatory or not; I'll let someone more qualified make that decision.



Pichi, thanks for your information, and your dedication to tango. While
we've disagreed on some issues, we've agreed on many more, and I
appreciate your steadfastness and your love of "Tango Milonguero".



Teo, I don't even know if you read this list, but its lots of fun!!!
Thanks for your article on the "true" tango, but I warned you!!! Hey
guys, give Teo a break, he just couldn't get the website changed quickly
enough. But Teo, you are right on the mark on most of the issues in your
article. But then I know you know that; you've danced in Denver, and in
Buenos Aires!!! The two best venues in the world!



Yup, it's me, and I tried my best to convey my very strong convictions
without castigating! How did I do?



We have Cacho Dante coming soon, and a big milonga with Glovertango in
November....come to Houston for some tango!



Regards,



Michael from Houston

Date: Thu, 7 Oct 2004 17:04:43 +1000
From: Gary Barnes <garybarn@OZEMAIL.COM.AU>
Subject: Re: "True Tango"

it seems that around 07/10/04 4:47 PM, Michael Figart II at
michaelfigart@YAHOO.COM wrote (among other things):

re "new tango"

> I've never seen the
> follower giggling with happiness, or overcome with awe at the intimacy
> of the lead, or even crying at the power of the mutual experience

I have seen all of these things, when I have led tango nuevo. And I am not
even very good at it.

never say never...


--

Gary Barnes
Canberra, Australia

"more tango, more often"