4629 To dance or not to dance-- that is the question
Date: Tue, 10 Oct 2006 09:11:01 -1200
From: "Michael" <tangomaniac@cavtel.net>
Subject: Re: [Tango-L] To dance or not to dance-- that is the question
To: "Igor Polk" <ipolk@virtuar.com>, <tango-l@mit.edu>
Cc: tangomaniac@cavtel.net
> Nina wrote: "Many years ago, a great dancer told me that
there is no reason to > dance every tanda. If one dances
twice or three times, or even only once during an evening,
but with an incredible partner and to the perfect for that
moment music, then being at the milonga for hours was worth
it."
>
> Does it mean that one SHOULD NOT DANCE every tanda?
>
> Igor Polk.
Igor:
Nina wrote that QUALITY is more important than QUANTITY.
When I started dancing, I thought the ONLY way I could
better was to dance as many tandas as possible to get as
much experience as possible. This begs the question "Is BAD
tango better than NO tango?"
I'm still recovering from the car collision I was in nine
weeks ago. I can't dance every tanda and can't dance at my
usual level because one of my muscles atrophied. So for the
few tandas I can dance, I want it just like Nina described
above.
She didn't write "don't dance every tanda." She did write be
selective about the tandas you dance.
Michael Ditkoff
Washington, DC
Almost made a deal with the devil to recover from the car
collision
I'd rather be dancing Argentine Tango
Date: Tue, 10 Oct 2006 17:45:36 EDT
From: JFPaloma@aol.com
Subject: [Tango-L] To dance or not to dance
To: tango-l@mit.edu
Hi Igor,
I think dancing every tanda would be like going to a buffet and eating
everything that is laid out on the table. Eating just for the sake of eating
rather than choosing the foods that truly delight might leave you feeling full
but unsatisfied.
Julie
Date: Tue, 10 Oct 2006 15:17:35 -0700
From: "Igor Polk" <ipolk@virtuar.com>
Subject: Re: [Tango-L] To dance or not to dance-- that is the question
To: "Michael" <tangomaniac@cavtel.net>, <tango-l@mit.edu>
Good. So that "great dancer" is wrong. Good.
There is a reason to dance every tanda. It is not necessary, but if one (
like me ) dances every tanda he is not crazy or something.
Thank you!
( or may be I am? )
Igor.
PS. I hope you getting better and will be able completely recover, Michael!
I wish you good health and tangos!
"To dance!!!"
-----Original Message-----
From: Michael [mailto:tangomaniac@cavtel.net]
Sent: Tuesday, October 10, 2006 1:11 PM
To: Igor Polk; tango-l@mit.edu
Cc: tangomaniac@cavtel.net
Subject: Re: [Tango-L] To dance or not to dance-- that is the question
> Nina wrote: "Many years ago, a great dancer told me that
there is no reason to > dance every tanda. If one dances
twice or three times, or even only once during an evening,
but with an incredible partner and to the perfect for that
moment music, then being at the milonga for hours was worth
it."
>
> Does it mean that one SHOULD NOT DANCE every tanda?
>
> Igor Polk.
Igor:
Nina wrote that QUALITY is more important than QUANTITY...
Michael
Date: Tue, 10 Oct 2006 16:17:12 -0700
From: "Igor Polk" <ipolk@virtuar.com>
Subject: [Tango-L] To dance or not to dance
To: <tango-l@mit.edu>
Julie:
"I think dancing every tanda would be like going to a buffet and eating
everything that is laid out on the table. Eating just for the sake of
eating
rather than choosing the foods that truly delight might leave you feeling
full
but unsatisfied. "
Why do you assume that if I dance every tanda, it is like going in a buffet?
Absolutely not !
All my partners are great and we have tango moments !
Ever dance is good and unique in some way.
Can not believe it?
Igor.
Date: Tue, 10 Oct 2006 17:59:02 -0700 (MST)
From: Huck Kennedy <huck@eninet.eas.asu.edu>
Subject: Re: [Tango-L] To dance or not to dance
To: tango-l@Mit.edu
Igor writes:
> Nina wrote:
>
> > "Many years ago, a great dancer told me that there is no
> > reason to dance every tanda. If one dances twice or three
> > times, or even only once during an evening, but with an
> > incredible partner (incredible for this person - after all,
> > what may be an apple of my eye is apple sauce to someone
> > else!) and to the perfect for that moment music, then being
> > at the milonga for hours was worth it."
> >
> > Does it mean that one SHOULD NOT DANCE every tanda?
I sometimes wonder, with morbid curiosity and
a bit of a shudder, what people who obsessively
insist on dancing every tanda are like in bed.
Huck
Date: Tue, 10 Oct 2006 21:09:40 -0400
From: "Michael" <tangomaniac@cavtel.net>
Subject: Re: [Tango-L] To dance or not to dance
To: "Huck Kennedy" <huck@eninet.eas.asu.edu>, <tango-l@mit.edu>
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Tuesday, October 10, 2006 8:59 PM
Subject: Re: [Tango-L] To dance or not to dance
I sometimes wonder, with morbid curiosity and a bit of a shudder, what
people who obsessively insist on dancing every tanda are like in bed.
>
> Huck
I wonder if cabeceo works to get them into bed.
Michael
Date: Tue, 10 Oct 2006 21:12:38 -0400
From: "Michael" <tangomaniac@cavtel.net>
Subject: Re: [Tango-L] To dance or not to dance
To: "Huck Kennedy" <huck@eninet.eas.asu.edu>, <tango-l@mit.edu>
Cc: Michael <tangomaniac@cavtel.net>
I sometimes wonder, with morbid curiosity and a bit of a shudder, what
people who obsessively insist on dancing every tanda are like in bed.
>
> Huck
I wonder if you have to use cabeceo to get them into bed?
Michael
Date: Tue, 10 Oct 2006 19:04:07 -0700
From: "Igor Polk" <ipolk@virtuar.com>
Subject: Re: [Tango-L] To dance or not to dance
To: <tango-l@Mit.edu>
I sometimes wonder, with morbid curiosity and a bit of a shudder, what
people who obsessively insist on dancing every tanda are like in bed.
Huck
Dear Huck,
Of course, I have prepared another very funny message for you, but I decided
not to bring it here now since I can answer you with good reasoning.
It looks like you are talking about me. I do not insist on dancing every
tanda. I feel that there are some snobs which believe that dancing with only
certain people is the Right Way. Well, I do not care about it, unless they
think ( like probably you ) that when others dance every tanda, it is not
good. I do not care about it either, but since it might affect other people,
or their opinions, I think it is appropriate to discuss it and ask to listen
to my point of view.
Firstly, I usually dance once a week and 3 hour of dance is far to little
for me. Let us see how many dances it is: on average 12 tango tandas only !
3 valses and 3 milongas ! Oh...
There are literally dozens of tango styles ! Classical styles. I can dance
most of them. And I want to dance them to improve in every style and to
invent more new elements and style definitions. This is difficult to
practice at a milonga I go, especially providing that a style must match its
appropriate music, and some "modern" DJs sometimes like to inject some
non-tangos there.
I can not afford to lose a tanda, if I want to progress!
Secondly, I have a lot of tango friends. Way more than 18. Yes, some of them
might be not as advanced as You, but never the less their dance with me is
very good. And I myself learn a lot from them. This is something more than
tango. This is friendship, this is socialization.
I can not afford to loose a tanda, otherwise how can I explain a friend why
I haven't danced with her!?
Thirdly, I am interested in proliferation of good tango. I do spend a lot of
my valuable as you can see time with them.
So, how can not I dance every tanda?
Besides, coming closer to your sentence, I do have so much energy that 3
hour of dancing is nothing for me. I need 12 hours.
Have a nice night!
Igor.
Date: Wed, 11 Oct 2006 12:13:22 -0700
From: "Igor Polk" <ipolk@virtuar.com>
Subject: Re: [Tango-L] To dance or not to dance
To: <tango-l@mit.edu>
Caroline:
"I've found that the more I go to milongas, the more discerning I've become
of who I want to dance with. But that's normal, I think. "
It only means you do not have enough of good leaders in your community.
Try some new guys. They might have some talent. Do not close your circuit !
Keep it open. And you will find ( and grow up ) enough leaders for the whole
milonga non-stop.
Igor.
Date: Wed, 11 Oct 2006 12:13:42 -0700 (PDT)
From: Marisa Holmes <mariholmes@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Tango-L] To dance or not to dance
To: tango-l@mit.edu
Should you dance every dance? We see from Igor and
Caroline's postings that this is not the same question
for a leader and a follower. We see from other
postings that it also varies by community, level of
expertise, and the goal the person has for being at
the milonga. And so, as usual, we see that the poster
who says either yes or no ? and extends that answer to
other people - is probably either not thinking through
the question or is trying to change a community by
laying down the law and hoping others will buy into
their vision.
Most people in my current community dance quite a bit.
And I must say that the people who accept or invite
for almost every dance seem to become better dancers
sooner. There's no doubt that time on the floor
contributes to increasing expertise, even if any
particular dance is not good. And you can readily
avoid individual partners if they do not fit into your
plans. But, as others have said, the milonga is also
a social event. And the people who spend more time
talking seem to become better friends with other
people sooner. This is a straightforward tradeoff.
You can't do both fulltime, but you can find a balance
that suits you. And in a community where many people
dance a lot and are used to a large number of
partners, you are in a good position to show visitors
a good time and to integrate new people smoothly.
I used to be part of a small community that had
developed a group habit of dancing few dances in an
evening. I believe it arose from the example of a
particular teacher there. But the result, which I
found ridiculous, was that in a group of only about 20
or 30 people, you would go to a milonga and only dance
a couple of times, unless you had a steady partner and
the two of you were willing to challenge the status
quo and dance in the face of group indifference.
Otherwise, you were welcome to imitate the old timers,
sitting at a little table, glowering at the floor, and
waiting for that perfect song and the perfect moment.
You just weren't welcome to talk to them because they
were nursing their mufarse.
It always seemed to me that influential members of
this second community had bought into a vision of "how
tango ought to be" which was appropriate to Buenos
Aires, where one could go any night of the week to any
of a large number of milongas, year after year. In
those circumstances it is reasonable and appropriate
for a person who has been dancing for decades to use
the milonga as a place to meet friends and dance or
not as they see fit. In a place which had only one
3-hour milonga a week the result was that the group
stayed small and was not able to readily integrate new
people (who desperately needed the time on the floor
and the experience of dancing with a variety of
people) or to cheerfully invite visitors when they
appeared.
You can guess which group I prefer. And yet I myself
dance different amounts on different days, sometimes a
few as three or four tandas in a four-hour stretch,
sometimes on the floor continuously except to take a
drink.
Marisa
Date: Wed, 11 Oct 2006 15:29:22 -0400
From: "Jacob Eggers" <eggers@brandeis.edu>
Subject: Re: [Tango-L] To dance or not to dance
To: tango-l@mit.edu
<dfa4cf020610111229v1df13ab2mc294a0e3c7e82b4d@mail.gmail.com>
It's easy as a leader to say that you can have a night of dancing
every tanda because there are more good followers out there than good
leaders. (It's something that I've only recently appreciated)
However, even for me as a leader. I find that I have usually have a
better night if I only dance for my absolute favorite tandas and
dancers. Either every dance can be good with some amazing dances, or
every dance can be AMAZING. I find that I'm happier if every dance is
amazing. This is not because of a lack of good followers, but because
the difference in quality between the best followers and the good
ones.
Still, I usually find that I'm unable to sit out and so >80% of the
time I still dance >80% of the tandas in a night (excluding all night
milongas).
j
On 10/11/06, Igor Polk <ipolk@virtuar.com> wrote:
> Caroline:
> "I've found that the more I go to milongas, the more discerning I've become
> of who I want to dance with. But that's normal, I think. "
>
> It only means you do not have enough of good leaders in your community.
> Try some new guys. They might have some talent. Do not close your circuit !
> Keep it open. And you will find ( and grow up ) enough leaders for the whole
> milonga non-stop.
>
> Igor.
>
>
Date: Wed, 11 Oct 2006 15:50:40 -0400
From: "Caroline Polack" <runcarolinerun@hotmail.com>
Subject: [Tango-L] To dance or not to dance
To: tango-l@mit.edu
"And you will find ( and grow up ) enough leaders for the whole
milonga non-stop."
"And grow up"?
Huh? Wha? If I like a leader, I will dance with him. If I don't like him or
his dancing, I won't. Igor, you are starting to get a habit of making
assumptions about me.
Caroline
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Date: Wed, 11 Oct 2006 16:05:17 -0400
From: "WHITE 95 R" <white95r@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Tango-L] To dance or not to dance
To: eggers@brandeis.edu, tango-l@mit.edu
>From: "Jacob Eggers" <eggers@brandeis.edu>
>
>It's easy as a leader to say that you can have a night of dancing
>every tanda because there are more good followers out there than good
>leaders. (It's something that I've only recently appreciated)
Not true. I think the numbers are about equal.
>
>However, even for me as a leader. I find that I have usually have a
>better night if I only dance for my absolute favorite tandas and
>dancers. Either every dance can be good with some amazing dances, or
>every dance can be AMAZING. I find that I'm happier if every dance is
>amazing. This is not because of a lack of good followers, but because
>the difference in quality between the best followers and the good
>ones.
Of course it's better if all one's dances are "wow".. But how can you make
sure of that? Even if you restrict yourself to dance only with your fave
partners and to the music you like best, there is no guarantee that you'll
have AMAZING dances. No 2 dances are alike and you'll spend time in vain if
you go chasing for that special "tango high" (-;
>
>Still, I usually find that I'm unable to sit out and so >80% of the
>time I still dance >80% of the tandas in a night (excluding all night
>milongas).
This is more like it. Now I can agree with you. Generally what you say is
true and I would be happy with those percentages. Unfortunately, the quality
of the dancers present and the skill of the DJ can make or break the
milonga. I've been to too many milongas wre the music was abominable and
even with the best dancers I could not get satifyingly good dances. Also,
sometimes the best dancers might not be available and even with good music,
the dance experience is not superb. This is why I'm choosy about which
milongas I attend. I avoid the ones with DJs who play music I don't like or
those fequented by dancers who are not a good "fit" for me (usually those
are one and the same).
Manuel
Date: Wed, 11 Oct 2006 19:50:24 -0700 (PDT)
From: "Trini y Sean (PATangoS)" <patangos@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Tango-L] To dance or not to dance
Sounds like there is too much overanalyzing going on over
this topic.
I'm sure at some point most people on this list wanted to
dance every tanda they possibly could. But the decision to
not dance every tanda, when it comes, is one that just
happens without much thought.
There are times when I wish I could go back to when I
"didn't know any better" and could dance with anyone and
still have fun, even with bad music.
Then I remember that it is all about attitude.
Trini de Pittsburgh
P.S. The bad music usually becomes practice time for me
and my partner to just start goofing off on the floor.
PATangoS - Pittsburgh Argentine Tango Society
Our Mission: To make Argentine Tango Pittsburgh's most popular social dance.
https://www.pitt.edu/~mcph/PATangoWeb.htm
