3329  myths of buenos aires

Date: Thu, 31 Mar 2005 14:29:56 -0800
From: robin thomas <niborsamoht@YAHOO.COM>
Subject: myths of buenos aires

i4m in bs.as. right now and i think
i know what burak experienced. he probably danced with
young people. there seems to be a really big split
between how the younger crowd and older crowd dance.
the young ones seem to not really dance close at all
and as soon as there is the slightest space they open
up the embrace. a lot of them don4t dance at all
unless there is room for them to dance open. some
don4t even go to milongas and just go to practicas
which feel a lot like late nighters at the festivals
around the u.s.. they4re a lot of fun and people are
doing really creative stuff.
at more traditional milongas older people dance pretty
much exactly letter for letter the way close embrace
is taught by many teachers in the states. although
they generally have a lot more sophisticated
musicality and dance "con sentimiento".

in the states we seem to have too hybrids, we dance
close but with sometimes more complicated steps and we
dance open with more emphasis on connection to your
partner.

it4s my fourth time hear but i haven4t been here for
four years and i've only been here a week so i4m sure
my impressions are completely subjective and there is
an impressive array of exceptions.

robin thomas

Date: Thu, 31 Mar 2005 17:52:31 -0600
From: el turco <shusheta@GMAIL.COM>
Subject: Re: myths of buenos aires

Robin is right, i mostly got dances with young followers since the
hierarchy barrier between young foreigner leaders and old portenas is
still there. For any good looking foreigner followers, there is no
problem to get dances with 10-40 years of tango experienced old
portenos. Therefore, my experiences sure lack this side.

That's why, I believe that US will be the most diversed and high
quality close embrace style dancing thanks to many Close embrace
instructors and festivals.

Also, In the states, young and old tango dancers mostly get mixed, so
there is good interaction between those groups (although some folks
don't like to see kids(!) around when they are having special romantic
dances.)


There are more than 10 Argentine Tango Clubs in the states ( Stanford,
Univ. of Michigan, Univ. of Colorado, Washington Univ. Yale, Cal Tech,
Univ. of Minnesota, Univ. of Wisconsin, Purdue, Univ. of Illinois
Urbana- Champaign, Emory, MIT, etc.)
In Argentina, there are no student org. related to Argentine Tango as
far as i searched so far)

I met Argentine Tango in a University Dance Club 5 years ago in
Ankara, Turkey. Currently there are more than 5 tango clubs
established in several universities in Turkey.

I believe that the tango clubs will have the main role of mixing young
and old crowd any where on this planet even in Argentina.

BsAs praticas Vs milongas:
the separation of young crowd from old crowd has something todo with
hospitality and encouragement from old tango dancers. They cretaed
their own milongas ( C.E.T.A.- Experimental milonga Sundays Venezuela
754) ( Luciana Valle et al. practica on Mondays, and other Friday
practicas at Villa Malcolm, and Pablo Inza et al. Tuesday practica in
Abasto or Wednesday night practica milonga at La Viruta) also
altenative mlonga- La Marshal gives freedom to anyone who wants dance
with partners from any gender.Villa Malcolm practicas smell like
Non-Argentine milonga, however the social barriers still visible,
poeple dance with their friends only, not a real practica, rearly you
see some people work on their tango. Pablo Inza et al. Tuesday
practica is more like practica, more people work on their tango.


Milongueros-(once they were young too) used to do the same thing in
50s, unfortunately only guys got together in clubs and practice, tried
new "stuff", then goto milonga grab a woman and try to show other guys
if they can do the new stuff they practiced. In 50s this was "new" for
traditional tango, but gave birth to "practicas".Nowadays the history
repeats itself, young milongueros from 50s, replaced by young tango
dancers from 21st century, the young crowd will be called as "nuevo
milongueros-tangueros" but note that there would be a BIG difference
between "milonguero" and "nuevo milonguero" female dancers will be
more dominant, more teachers and more dancers than male dancers and
teachers.
we couldn't have chance to dance with many milongueras, for sure next
generation will be more lucky.
Sincerely,
burak
Minneapolis
www.tangoshusheta.com




On Thu, 31 Mar 2005 14:29:56 -0800, robin thomas <niborsamoht@yahoo.com> wrote:

> i4m in bs.as. right now and i think
> i know what burak experienced. he probably danced with
> young people. there seems to be a really big split
> between how the younger crowd and older crowd dance.
> the young ones seem to not really dance close at all
> and as soon as there is the slightest space they open
> up the embrace. a lot of them don4t dance at all
> unless there is room for them to dance open. some
> don4t even go to milongas and just go to practicas
> which feel a lot like late nighters at the festivals
> around the u.s.. they4re a lot of fun and people are
> doing really creative stuff.
> at more traditional milongas older people dance pretty
> much exactly letter for letter the way close embrace
> is taught by many teachers in the states. although
> they generally have a lot more sophisticated
> musicality and dance "con sentimiento".
>
> in the states we seem to have too hybrids, we dance
> close but with sometimes more complicated steps and we
> dance open with more emphasis on connection to your
> partner.
>
> it4s my fourth time hear but i haven4t been here for
> four years and i've only been here a week so i4m sure
> my impressions are completely subjective and there is
> an impressive array of exceptions.
>
> robin thomas
>
>
>

Date: Thu, 31 Mar 2005 18:04:02 -0800
From: NANCY <ningle_2000@YAHOO.COM>
Subject: Re: myths of buenos aires

--- robin thomas <niborsamoht@YAHOO.COM> wrote:
much exactly letter for letter the way close embrace

> is taught by many teachers in the states. although
> they generally have a lot more sophisticated
> musicality and dance "con sentimiento".

As a veteran of BsAs and of US dancing, I agree with
Robin on both counts. The tangueros of BsAs dance
with great musicality and feeling, but the American
men are far more creative and adventurous. Robin,
for instance, makes me giggle with glee and squeal in
surprise evey time I dance with him. The old guys of
BsAs put me in 'the zone' with their repertoires of
4-8 steps.

And to the guy who made vast generalizations about
who dances what in BsAs, I can guarantee you that
every man dances differently from every other man and
they all say they dance their 'own style' and do not
credit any one person with that style except
themselves.

Looking forward to a wide range of styles and
exquisite surprises from my friends in Atlanta and to
new experiences with new friends.

Nancy
Florida

<<Rito es la danza en tu vida
y el tango que tu amas
te quema en su llama>>
de: Bailarina de tango
por: Horacio Sanguinetti

Date: Thu, 31 Mar 2005 20:53:43 -0800
From: Derik Rawson <rawsonweb@YAHOO.COM>
Subject: Re: myths of buenos aires

--- el turco <shusheta@GMAIL.COM> wrote:

> Robin is right, i mostly got dances with young
> followers since the
> hierarchy barrier between young foreigner leaders
> and old portenas is
> still there. For any good looking foreigner
> followers, there is no
> problem to get dances with 10-40 years of tango
> experienced old
> portenos. Therefore, my experiences sure lack this
> side.
>
> That's why, I believe that US will be the most
> diversed and high
> quality close embrace style dancing thanks to many
> Close embrace
> instructors and festivals.
>
> Also, In the states, young and old tango dancers
> mostly get mixed, so
> there is good interaction between those groups
> (although some folks
> don't like to see kids(!) around when they are
> having special romantic
> dances.)
>
>
> There are more than 10 Argentine Tango Clubs in the
> states ( Stanford,
> Univ. of Michigan, Univ. of Colorado, Washington
> Univ. Yale, Cal Tech,
> Univ. of Minnesota, Univ. of Wisconsin, Purdue,
> Univ. of Illinois
> Urbana- Champaign, Emory, MIT, etc.)
> In Argentina, there are no student org. related to
> Argentine Tango as
> far as i searched so far)
>
> I met Argentine Tango in a University Dance Club 5
> years ago in
> Ankara, Turkey. Currently there are more than 5
> tango clubs
> established in several universities in Turkey.
>
> I believe that the tango clubs will have the main
> role of mixing young
> and old crowd any where on this planet even in
> Argentina.
>
> BsAs praticas Vs milongas:
> the separation of young crowd from old crowd has
> something todo with
> hospitality and encouragement from old tango
> dancers. They cretaed
> their own milongas ( C.E.T.A.- Experimental milonga
> Sundays Venezuela
> 754) ( Luciana Valle et al. practica on Mondays, and
> other Friday
> practicas at Villa Malcolm, and Pablo Inza et al.
> Tuesday practica in
> Abasto or Wednesday night practica milonga at La
> Viruta) also
> altenative mlonga- La Marshal gives freedom to
> anyone who wants dance
> with partners from any gender.Villa Malcolm
> practicas smell like
> Non-Argentine milonga, however the social barriers
> still visible,
> poeple dance with their friends only, not a real
> practica, rearly you
> see some people work on their tango. Pablo Inza et
> al. Tuesday
> practica is more like practica, more people work on
> their tango.
>
>
> Milongueros-(once they were young too) used to do
> the same thing in
> 50s, unfortunately only guys got together in clubs
> and practice, tried
> new "stuff", then goto milonga grab a woman and try
> to show other guys
> if they can do the new stuff they practiced. In 50s
> this was "new" for
> traditional tango, but gave birth to
> "practicas".Nowadays the history
> repeats itself, young milongueros from 50s, replaced
> by young tango
> dancers from 21st century, the young crowd will be
> called as "nuevo
> milongueros-tangueros" but note that there would be
> a BIG difference
> between "milonguero" and "nuevo milonguero" female
> dancers will be
> more dominant, more teachers and more dancers than
> male dancers and
> teachers.
> we couldn't have chance to dance with many
> milongueras, for sure next
> generation will be more lucky.
> Sincerely,
> burak
> Minneapolis
> www.tangoshusheta.com
>
>
>
>
> On Thu, 31 Mar 2005 14:29:56 -0800, robin thomas
> <niborsamoht@yahoo.com> wrote:
> > i4m in bs.as. right now and i think
> > i know what burak experienced. he probably danced
> with
> > young people. there seems to be a really big split
> > between how the younger crowd and older crowd
> dance.
> > the young ones seem to not really dance close at
> all
> > and as soon as there is the slightest space they
> open
> > up the embrace. a lot of them don4t dance at all
> > unless there is room for them to dance open. some
> > don4t even go to milongas and just go to practicas
> > which feel a lot like late nighters at the
> festivals
> > around the u.s.. they4re a lot of fun and people
> are
> > doing really creative stuff.
> > at more traditional milongas older people dance
> pretty
> > much exactly letter for letter the way close
> embrace
> > is taught by many teachers in the states. although
> > they generally have a lot more sophisticated
> > musicality and dance "con sentimiento".
> >
> > in the states we seem to have too hybrids, we
> dance
> > close but with sometimes more complicated steps
> and we
> > dance open with more emphasis on connection to
> your
> > partner.
> >
> > it4s my fourth time hear but i haven4t been here
> for
> > four years and i've only been here a week so i4m
> sure
> > my impressions are completely subjective and there
> is
> > an impressive array of exceptions.
> >
> > robin thomas
> >
> >
> site!
> >
>
>

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Date: Thu, 31 Mar 2005 20:58:29 -0800
From: Derik Rawson <rawsonweb@YAHOO.COM>
Subject: Re: myths of buenos aires

Dear Barak and Robin:

Perhaps the young people in Buenos Aires know
something. Maybe they know that there are more
possibilities with their approach to tango. They are
the ones who will decide tango's future, not the old
guys. Personally, I prefer experimentation, rather
that old stuff all the time. Just my opinion.

PS- I am glad that you guys are having and had a
great time in Buenos Aires. Life is good.

Derik
d.rawson@rawsonweb.com


--- el turco <shusheta@GMAIL.COM> wrote:

> Robin is right, i mostly got dances with young
> followers since the
> hierarchy barrier between young foreigner leaders
> and old portenas is
> still there. For any good looking foreigner
> followers, there is no
> problem to get dances with 10-40 years of tango
> experienced old
> portenos. Therefore, my experiences sure lack this
> side.
>
> That's why, I believe that US will be the most
> diversed and high
> quality close embrace style dancing thanks to many
> Close embrace
> instructors and festivals.