5655  Invitation & refusal

Date: Sun, 7 Jun 2009 19:40:44 +0200
From: Melina Sedo & Detlef Engel <tango@tangodesalon.de>
Subject: [Tango-L] Invitation & refusal

>

Hi all.


Dan asked:

>
> In the end, and dare I raise the question, "Should a woman ever
> ask a
> man to dance" at a milonga that is? If they're friends, dance
> partners
> etc. that's a different story. I don't think it generally fits in
> with the
> style, origins and etiquette of tango. My personal opinion.....well
> let's hear
> it from you all first.

My opinion as a woman and sort-of-traditionalist:

NOBODY (neither men nor women) should invite directly by asking
someone to dance with him. If you're using the Cabeceo (Mirada) you
don't have to and both (men and women) can take the initiative, as it
is practised not only in BA, but in lots of other Milongas all over
the globe.
The benfits of the Cabeceo have been discussed exhaustively. I try to
spread the word of it wherever we go.

So, me practising the Cabeceo, I would never invite a man directly,
unless he's a close friend. And I will also refuse most direct
invitations, that are are not done by the Cabeceo or don't come from
someone, whom I personally. I will do it politely and explain why.

But Dan's question rather could be read as: Should a women be allowed
to invite a man directly?

And here's a YES from me!
In a setting where men are allowed to invite directly, why should
women be not?
Hey! We're living in the 20th century. Why should women not be allowed
to invite a man, rather than sit around all night, because they're not
noticed or unknown or because nobody knows how to use the Cabeceo in
that place. Go women! Do it politely, not being pushy and willing to
accept a refusal. Same rights, same risks. ;-)

About refusals:
It's definetely not nice to refuse everyone, whom you believe to be a
lower-level-dancer as yourself or not good-looking enough or too old.
A refusal should not come too lightly, as it can hurt the person in
question.
But nobody should be obliged to dance with someone out of
misunderstood chivalry, potliteness or whatever. If you refuse
someone, do it nicely, try not to be rude. But if you're feeling, that
you would suffer, in case you danced with that specific person: Don't!
I've seen enough women (and men) shuffle around the dancefloor with
bored, angry or painstruck expressions, and trying to mimick a
friendly face between the dances. That's ridiculous and dishonest.
So, be brave and say "No", if you mean "No"!
And to those who invite directly: Please accept a polite refusal
without being hurt or revengeful. If you are not willing to accept the
refusal, please dont ask "Do you want to dance with me", because this
is a question, that allows a "No". Just say: "You have to dance with
me - now." That would be at least honest.

Have a nice day,


Melina



MELINA SEDO & DETLEF ENGEL
www.tangodesalon.de
www.youtube.com/tangodesalon
tango@tangodesalon.de
(0049) (0)681 9381839
(0049) (0)177 4340669

Date: Tue, 9 Jun 2009 18:08:50 +0930
From: "Pat Petronio" <petronio@adam.com.au>
Subject: Re: [Tango-L] Invitation & refusal
To: <tango-l@mit.edu>

Long live the cabeceo!

It protects everyone. The tradition developed for good reasons, as did the
other milonga codes.
The communication involved is uncomplicated body language. Difficult to
teach? What's so hard about it? As long as you can make eye contact with
another person, you can do it.

When visiting tango communities where cabeceo use is virtually non-existent,
it seems somewhat harder to get a dance. My observation is that people tend
to invite only those dancers they already know (possible already knowing
they would accept), because they were using the direct invitation method.
Whereas the cabeceo method seems to open up the likelihood of invitations to
dance to others, too.

Regards to all

Patricia Petronio
Tango Sal?n Adelaide
www.tangosalonadelaide.blogspot.com

Date: Tue, 9 Jun 2009 22:41:55 +0930
From: "roger" <roger@websa.com.au>
Subject: Re: [Tango-L] Invitation & refusal and dancing to anything.
To: <tango-l@mit.edu>

I have turned offers of dances down, because I don't feel anything for that
set of songs/tunes and consequently will not do it justice. I will however
promise to dance the next tanda that "turns me on".



This leads me to ask a question:-



Has anyone else noticed that some people seem to dance to everything. I only
want to dance to music that "turns me on" and sometimes feel emotional
exhausted so use the next tanda to recover.

I can remember a million years ago when frequenting discos, that people
would say "this is my favourite, I have to dance to this".

I often fail to see this at milongas that I go to. Some people will dance to
every tanda., indiscriminately. I am interested to know if this is noted
elsewhere.



Roger Spence

Tango Adelaide

www.tangoadelaide.org

Date: Tue, 9 Jun 2009 07:35:56 -0700 (PDT)
From: Jack Dylan <jackdylan007@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Tango-L] Invitation & refusal and dancing to anything.
To: tango-l@mit.edu

> From: roger <roger@websa.com.au>
> Some people will dance to
> every tanda., indiscriminately. > >

Perhaps they just love to dance and/or enjoy
a wider taste in tango music than you do.

Jack

Date: Tue, 9 Jun 2009 10:45:26 EDT
From: C21DARI@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Tango-L] Invitation & refusal and dancing to anything.
To: tango-l@mit.edu

In a message dated 6/9/2009 9:12:53 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
roger@websa.com.au writes:

Has anyone else noticed that some people seem to dance to everything

In reference to that sentence on your post, I have seen dancers dancing
even to the National Anthon music (very common expression in Argentina
refer to those who dance to everything) some people dance tango in cruise
control no feelings

Dario


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Date: Wed, 10 Jun 2009 21:17:02 +0200
From: "Meister Richard Kvhnlein (Der schnelle Shop)"
<yahoo@koenigsdino.de>
Subject: Re: [Tango-L] Invitation & refusal

I am living in the 21th century!

----- Original Message -----

From: "Melina Sedo & Detlef Engel" <tango@tangodesalon.de>
Sent: Sunday, June 07, 2009 7:40 PM
Subject: [Tango-L] Invitation & refusal


Hey! We're living in the 20th century.

Date: Wed, 10 Jun 2009 22:04:42 +0200
From: "Peter Turowski" <tangopeter@gmx.de>
Subject: Re: [Tango-L] Invitation & refusal

> I am living in the 21th century!
> Hey! We're living in the 20th century.

betwixt and between...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c1KEFgD6Dtg

Refused
Peter

--
Peter Turowski
tangopeter@gmx.de
www.tangopeter.de

Date: Wed, 10 Jun 2009 17:02:25 -0400
From: Kathryn Johns <tangoartist@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Tango-L] Invitation & refusal
To: Meister Richard K?hnlein (Der schnelle Shop)
<yahoo@koenigsdino.de>
Cc: tango-l@mit.edu
<370d16c10906101402j6720b89cwb94c7ca8ac4c3fba@mail.gmail.com>

Most of us are. That may explain a lot!

Kathryn

2009/6/10 Meister Richard K?hnlein (Der schnelle Shop) <yahoo@koenigsdino.de>:

> I am living in the 21th century!
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Melina Sedo & Detlef Engel" <tango@tangodesalon.de>
> Sent: Sunday, June 07, 2009 7:40 PM
> Subject: [Tango-L] Invitation & refusal
>
>
> Hey! We're living in the 20th century.
>

Date: Wed, 10 Jun 2009 21:17:02 +0200
From: "Meister Richard K?hnlein (Der schnelle Shop)"
<yahoo@koenigsdino.de>
Subject: Re: [Tango-L] Invitation & refusal

I am living in the 21th century!

----- Original Message -----

From: "Melina Sedo & Detlef Engel" <tango@tangodesalon.de>
Sent: Sunday, June 07, 2009 7:40 PM
Subject: [Tango-L] Invitation & refusal


Hey! We're living in the 20th century.