4109  Leading and following...

Date: Thu, 16 Mar 2006 12:35:13 -0300
From: Deby Novitz <dnovitz@LAVIDACONDEBY.COM>
Subject: Leading and following...

Aren4t you guys sick of writing about this? It is like beating a dead
horse....It is amazing, but here in Buenos Aires in my tango life, no
one ever talks about this. Either you like dancing with someone or you
don't, end of conversation. We do not sit around and dissect down to
the en th degree who is good who is not and every little detail of why
they are, why they are not and is the earth really round. Sometimes I
make a mistake and accept a dance with a man whose lead or whose embrace
is not good for me, for whatever reason, it doesn't matter. I simply
smile and say "thank you" at the end of the tanda and never accept a
dance again. Yes, every once in while I dance with an old friend who
was kind to me years ago and who cannot dance, but you know what? Life
is short and sometimes friendships are more important.

When I lived in San Francisco, it was easy to get an attitude after the
first 5 trips to Buenos Aires. You know what I mean..the people who
strut about the milongas letting people know how bad the dancers are in
their city and how great the dancers are in Buenos Aires, and how
horrible life is now that you have to come back and dance with the
proletariats. Hey those people exist even if they have never been to
Buenos Aires. Funny thing...but I have noticed (shoot me for this one),
most of those people cannot dance. (Including me, back then...)

The point is, you have choices in your life. Don't dance with people
you don't like dancing with. If you do dance with people you don't like
dancing with, then don't complain about it. Have you ever danced with
someone who you thought was a nightmare but the person next to you
swoons over how great they dance? Or have you ever thought someone was
a great dancer and only to have people look at you like you are crazy?
Who knows what creates the connection between people, but isn't tango
about 2 people?

Date: Thu, 16 Mar 2006 11:08:20 -0500
From: WHITE 95 R <white95r@HOTMAIL.COM>
Subject: Re: Leading and following...

>From: Deby Novitz <dnovitz@LAVIDACONDEBY.COM>

>The point is, you have choices in your life. Don't dance with people
>you don't like dancing with. If you do dance with people you don't like
>dancing with, then don't complain about it. Have you ever danced with
>someone who you thought was a nightmare but the person next to you
>swoons over how great they dance? Or have you ever thought someone was
>a great dancer and only to have people look at you like you are crazy?
>Who knows what creates the connection between people, but isn't tango
>about 2 people?

Excellent post Deby. Those are the best words I've read about the subject in
quite a while. You've said what I wish I had said. I think that all the
complaining and blaming accomplishes nothing except perhaps some sort of
therapeutic release by venting. I find the continual condemnation that some
folks heap upon the stereotypical "bad dancer" is tiring, demoralizing and a
total downer. I think that the old saying "it's better to light a candle
than to curse the darkness" might be applicable here. Or maybe even the
biblical admonition "remove the beam from thine eye....."

Manuel

Date: Thu, 16 Mar 2006 17:46:00 +0000
From: "Chris, UK" <tl2@CHRISJJ.COM>
Subject: Re: Leading and following...

Deby wrote:

> but isn't tango about 2 people?

Tango is more than about 2 people. That's why this discussion
includes the word "community".

It seems you're not a leader, else you'd certainly appreciate that
each couple dances with every other couple on the floor. Guys
often choose where to dance on the basis of the other guys rather
than just the girls, especially where some milongas with rough
guys and most have enough good girls.

In this context your

> Don't dance with people you don't like dancing with

is nothing like as easy to live by.

To find out how important the community aspect is to you, ask
yourself how much you'd enjoy an evening out where your
"2 people" were the only ones at the milonga.

Chris

Date: Thu, 16 Mar 2006 12:43:44 -0600
From: Zoltan Hidvegi <tango-l@HZOLI.COM>
Subject: Re: Leading and following...

Deby Novitz wrote:

> Aren4t you guys sick of writing about this? It is like beating a dead
> horse....

I think it is much more interesting than some previous discussions
here, even though people who live in cities with large tango
communities may find it hard to understand the issues. Certainly
Buenos Aires, New York, San Francisco etc. has enough dancers so that
a few bad apples has no significant impact. But in a small tango
community with very few advanced dancers a mediocre "show dancer" with
bad floorcraft may be able to sell himself as the local authority in
tango, and can use that to pursue every young new beginner women who
comes along. And this is Texas, where many people have to overcome
deep cultural obstacles to be able to dance a close-contact partner
dance like tango. It does not take much to scare away a beginner
from dancing. A good dancer have the knowledge to chose who she wants
to dance with, and if there are enough good dancers, then even the
beginners will get the picture by observing others. But with a
paucity of good leads, even good follows are tempted to dance with the
troublesome leaders because sometimes they are fun to dance with, and
it better than dancing with beginners.

So actually, this thread is not about bad leads, but about ways to
allow a small community to grow. We would like to get to the point
where we have daily milongas and enough people to tolerate all kinds
of eccentric behavior. Some of the problem leaders may be nice people
who would be a welcome addition to a large tango community.

-Zoltan
www.austintango.org