4349  Leading and following roles

Date: Thu, 01 Jun 2006 14:54:13 +0000
From: "Sergio Vandekier" <sergiovandekier990@hotmail.com>
Subject: [Tango-L] Leading and following roles
To: tango-l@mit.edu

After reading Astrid's note where she does not understand my sense of humor
I decided to share with you the thoughts of a German woman (the same as
Astrid). A young, beautiful woman and great tango dancer that immigrated in
Argentina a few years ago. This may clarify what I have been somewhat
unsuccessfully trying to explain.

Dear friends from Tango -L I am going to reproduce a paragraph from the book
by Nicole Nau and Ricardo Klapwijk. "Tango, un baile bien portenio" Pag.158
.

"Before I traveled to Argentina I did not know with clarity what my role in
tango was.
As a German I had been educated as a woman that " takes the role of the
man". A woman that at the very least knows as much as the man does. A woman
that can and does measure up to the masculine world.
I had never lived the man as my companion, as somebody to talk with in the
middle of a group, my interlocutor.

That desire to find a place by a man, was one of the reasons that, by
instinct I had discovered tango for myself . Tango was a place where I
finally could be a woman.
Full of sensations, intuitive, feminine and strong at the same time. I
learned how to be a companion without competing.

I started to enjoy the power of being able to mix my feminine strength with
the masculine one challenging it and at the same time to let myself to be
conquered.

I also learned with more precision in Argentina what leading and following
mean : both the woman and the man have the same value, but despite of that,
they are not equal in form; both are equally responsible with respect to the
couple but each one in his own role.

Each one in his own definition and in his own place. I started to understand
tango not only as leading and following but as leading and let somebody
guide you. A reciprocal companionship.

According to Maria Nieves, Carlos Copes dancing partner; "In real life the
woman is equal to the man and in tango this is true as well".

Finally, now I see it with clarity, if tango was merely an act of leading
and following in which masculine domination achieves a compulsory feminine
submission it would not be as excitant and as passionate. In this country
we dance something else than the success of the man over the woman."

**It is sad to say it but till you understand what I and Nicole try to
explain, you will not be dancing real Argentine tango. You will experience
something but not the real thing. It is difficult to explain what an orgasm
is to a person that never experienced one.

In the meantime let the ignorant ofend and insult me, the impatient
vituperate me, the unable to understand remain in condemning silence.
To see after a while how those same people copy and plagiarize my notes.
But do not worry I am used to it.

Have a good day, Sergio

Date: Fri, 2 Jun 2006 00:12:46 +0900
From: "astrid" <astrid@ruby.plala.or.jp>
Subject: [Tango-L] Fw: Leading and following roles
To: <tango-l@mit.edu>

> After reading Astrid's note where she does not understand my sense of

humor

> I decided to share with you the thoughts of a German woman (the same as
> Astrid).

Here comes the first stereotype. Are you saying that the reason I do not
understand "your sense of humour" is that I am German? May I ask, did anyone
else notice Sergio's "sense of humour" in his posting? What about Chris, who
is from the UK, I believe, Jake Spatz, with his indefinable "Eastern
European descent etc."? Anyway, ok, so Nicole is German and therefore she
must be the same as me, right...(Nicole lives in Holland, by the way).
Stereotype No. 2.

> As a German I had been educated as a woman that " takes the role of the
> man". A woman that at the very least knows as much as the man does. A

woman

> that can and does measure up to the masculine world.
> I had never lived the man as my companion, as somebody to talk with in the
> middle of a group, my interlocutor.

While it is true that in Germany, women are educated to have the same rights
as men (as least in theory) that does not mean, women and men are no
companions. As a matter of fact, I do not see any contradiction at all
between equality and companionship, talking in the middle of the group etc.,
IMO equality on the contrary facilitates companionship.

>
> That desire to find a place by a man, was one of the reasons that, by
> instinct I had discovered tango for myself . Tango was a place where I
> finally could be a woman.

Well, good for you, Nicole, but there are many ways to discover that in
life, one does not have to wait until one finally comes across tango...

> Full of sensations, intuitive, feminine and strong at the same time. I
> learned how to be a companion without competing.

Fine, accepted.

>
> I started to enjoy the power of being able to mix my feminine strength

with

> the masculine one challenging it and at the same time to let myself to be
> conquered.

Again, also here, one does not need to wait til one becomes a tango
dancer...

>
> I also learned with more precision in Argentina what leading and following
> mean : both the woman and the man have the same value, but despite of

that,

> they are not equal in form; both are equally responsible with respect to

the

> couple but each one in his own role.

This reminds me of what a German once said after coming back from a vaction
in Brazil:"Brazil is nice, but what I found really annoying is that the
Brazilians act as though they were the ones who invented sex"...
(...)
Then Sergio concludes:
It is difficult to explain what an orgasm

> is to a person that never experienced one.

May I ask what exactly you are trying to say about me, Sergio? ; )

Astrid

Date: Thu, 1 Jun 2006 12:21:56 -0700 (PDT)
From: "Trini y Sean \(PATangoS\)" <patangos@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Tango-L] Fw: Leading and following roles

--- astrid <astrid@ruby.plala.or.jp> wrote:

<chip> May I ask, did anyone else notice Sergio's
"sense of humour" in his posting? <chop>


Sean here. Yes, I did. Perhaps because I have the
advantage of knowing him personally. Sergio is a
master of sublimation and irony. Even when we
disagree, I find his posts to be remarkably
entertaining.

Sean