5811 So what is authentic Argentine tango?
Date: Mon, 19 Oct 2009 21:58:22 +1000
From: Vince Bagu?auskas <vytis@hotmail.com>
Subject: [Tango-L] So what is authentic Argentine tango?
To: <tango-l@mit.edu>
(Resent, because this borrowed computer had Rich Text as a default)
Reading the further postings on Tango 2000... for Dummies and the off list emails I have recieved, raises the suggestion that, the organisers should put up a sandwich board outside the milonga door/a notice in their newsletter/internet postings etc, that says clearly and plainly what style of dancing is permitted as conditions of entry (like entry to car-parks), rather than rely on quiet hope that the music will keep the riff-raff away (it doesn't as I have said in a previous post). Maybe like thus (borrowing from Tango L and elsewhere):
A/ Tango Milonga
It is a social activity consisting of
Meeting and dancing with friends old and new
Seeking a tango trance
Lanes that progress around the room; no zig-zagging around the middle
Smaller 2-3 step sequences and rock steps
Moderate strides and cautious boleos
Maybe occasional brushes with other dancers
B/ Authentic Argentine tango
(i) What is allowed?
Salon-style tango including:
milonguero/apilado/petitero/caquero/Villa Urquiza
club tango
Golden age tango music from the late 30?s to the 50?s
(ii) What is not allowed?
Tango orillero
Tango nuevo, including volcadas, kicks above the knee, multiple guanchos
Fantasia/salon tango
cayengue
tango music post 1950?s
alternative/neo tango music
Thoughts?
Cheers!
Vince
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Date: Mon, 19 Oct 2009 14:20:36 +0200
From: ECSEDY ?ron <aron@milonga.hu>
Subject: Re: [Tango-L] So what is authentic Argentine tango?
To: Tango-L <TANGO-L@MIT.EDU>
House rules. Well, these could be acceptable (as these are only syllabus
limitations and not arbitrary style-police), but enforcement may be
difficult. Especially, when the milonga statistics do not support it (50
people on a 15 by 25 meter/yard dancefloor with rules for small moves?).
However, in a modern world I do not believe that a milonga organizer
will consciously limit participation, unless the problem already is
overcrowding and the prices already went out on the roof...
Aron
Vince Bagu?auskas ?rta:
>
> (Resent, because this borrowed computer had Rich Text as a default)
>
>
>
> Reading the further postings on Tango 2000... for Dummies and the off list emails I have recieved, raises the suggestion that, the organisers should put up a sandwich board outside the milonga door/a notice in their newsletter/internet postings etc, that says clearly and plainly what style of dancing is permitted as conditions of entry (like entry to car-parks), rather than rely on quiet hope that the music will keep the riff-raff away (it doesn't as I have said in a previous post). Maybe like thus (borrowing from Tango L and elsewhere):
>
>
>
> A/ Tango Milonga
>
> It is a social activity consisting of
>
>
> Meeting and dancing with friends old and new
> Seeking a tango trance
> Lanes that progress around the room; no zig-zagging around the middle
> Smaller 2-3 step sequences and rock steps
> Moderate strides and cautious boleos
> Maybe occasional brushes with other dancers
>
>
> B/ Authentic Argentine tango
>
> (i) What is allowed?
>
> Salon-style tango including:
>
> milonguero/apilado/petitero/caquero/Villa Urquiza
> club tango
>
> Golden age tango music from the late 30?s to the 50?s
>
>
> (ii) What is not allowed?
>
>
> Tango orillero
> Tango nuevo, including volcadas, kicks above the knee, multiple guanchos
> Fantasia/salon tango
> cayengue
> tango music post 1950?s
> alternative/neo tango music
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Thoughts?
>
>
>
> Cheers!
>
> Vince
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Click Here View photos of singles in your area
> View photos of singles in your area Click Here
> https://clk.atdmt.com/NMN/go/150855801/direct/01/
>
--
Ecsedy ?ron
***********
Aron ECSEDY
Tel: +36 20 66-36-006
https://www.milonga.hu/
https://www.holgyvalasz.hu/
Date: Mon, 19 Oct 2009 09:58:42 -0400
From: Sergey Kazachenko <syarzhuk@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Tango-L] So what is authentic Argentine tango?
To: Vince Bagu?auskas <vytis@hotmail.com>
Cc: tango-l@mit.edu
<ebb7980c0910190658w65363e1dn282da5df4aed2c6d@mail.gmail.com>
On Mon, Oct 19, 2009 at 7:58 AM, Vince Bagu?auskas <vytis@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> Reading the further postings on Tango 2000... for Dummies and the off list emails I have recieved, raises the suggestion that,
>the organisers should put up a sandwich board outside the milonga door/a notice in their newsletter/internet postings etc,
>that says clearly and plainly what style of dancing is permitted as conditions of entry (like entry to car-parks), rather than
>rely on quiet hope that the music will keep the riff-raff away
"
Improper dancing will not be tolerated; persons so indulging will be
immediately ejected.
No moonlight or shadow lighting effect. The hall must remain fully lighted.
No dance shall continue after 3 o'clock a.m. unless by written
permission of the Mayor,and not later than 11:45 Saturdays.
Pass-out checks are not to be issued.
Matrons shall be employed at every public dance and have entire charge
of ladies' rooms.
Minors under the age of 17 years shall not be admitted to hall unless
accompanied by parent or guardian.
By special instructions of the directors of the Musician's Union, all
orchestras are directed to obey the orders of the representative of
the Mayor to cease playing should conditions so justify.
"
In the same article: "By orders of Mayor Fitzgerald yesterday,
improper dances of all kinds are excluded from the public dance halls
of Boston. The prohibition includes all the so-called animal dances,
such as the turkey trot, bunnie hug, bear dance, etc, also the kitchen
sink, tango and other extravagances."
>>From Boston Daily Globe October 11, 1913.
Take care,
Sergey
May you be forever touched by His Noodly Appendage... (
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flying_Spaghetti_Monster )
Date: Tue, 20 Oct 2009 06:06:22 +1000
From: Vince Bagu?auskas <vytis@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Tango-L] So what is authentic Argentine tango?
To: <macromagix@gmail.com>, <tango-l@mit.edu>
<c63a5fe70910191138ldbd7475m61cd5a74fbb95cb6@mail.gmail.com>
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
MIME-Version: 1.0
> whoa, hold on vince...
>
> but you included canyengue within
> your exclusions ! why,
As I understand read it, it is proto-tango not from the Golden Age of tango styles, involving flashy steps, more space. It is not tango as we k=
now it Tony.
Rock and roll at
> this is what nuevo dancers seem
> happy to ignore.
Some, salon style dancers do the same, owning the space. But that is OK because they are doing salaon? Plus as I have said, a majority of danc=
ers do nuevo steps to traditional music anyway, so it does not matter to them what is played. No-one at the milonga objects, the organiser does n=
ot red-card anyone, so that is OK too.
> vince, i don't think you can lay down rules/labels to exclude types of
> dance styles or steps.
If I stuggle to find on the net, what is authentic tango including the atmosphere surrounding a BsAs milonga, what hope the new dancer?
There is one tango I go to in Melbourne that promotes itself as an authentic piece of BsAs, but the music and the dance styles are as varied as anyt=
hing you have seen.
Good if this post encourages intelligent discussion and a concensus on what is authentic tango comes about so that devotees of such can be clear upon=
it in their rules and promotions. The off topic discssions I have had with people who say they love Golden Age tango but cannot tell me what is is=
, is very confusing.
cheers,
Vince
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Date: Tue, 20 Oct 2009 05:38:45 +1100
From: tony parkes <macromagix@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Tango-L] So what is authentic Argentine tango?
To: Vince Bagu?auskas <vytis@hotmail.com>, tango-l <tango-l@mit.edu>
<c63a5fe70910191138ldbd7475m61cd5a74fbb95cb6@mail.gmail.com>
whoa, hold on vince...
i agree with most of what you have writ, basically summarised as not
encouraging nuevo to be danced in traditional milonga venues whilst
traditional music is being played. but you included canyengue within
your exclusions ! why, when every dj in traditional milonga venues
plays at least one canyengue tanda a night - carlos at los
consagradros often plays 2 canyengue tandas, and if he plays a slow
donato tanda then you can count 3 canyengue tandas - muy bien :)
extrapolate this line of thought - when the dj plays vals, milonga,
canyengue, candombe, chacarera, rock'n'roll or a tango pugliese or di
sarli, then that is what you should try to dance. but if you are not
up to speed you either sit it out or else dance to the best of your
ability WITHOUT INTRUDING, without dancing contrary to both the
physical and kinetic energy flows. this is what nuevo dancers seem
happy to ignore.
for example, last tuesday at el arranque (given my age away haven't i)
was reasonably crowded so we all danced to our less than roughly 1x1
ie 1 square metre of floor space, except of course the young couple
dancing nuevo in the centre whose extravagant style demanded at least
2x2 metres ie 4 sqm of space.
vince, i don't think you can lay down rules/labels to exclude types of
dance styles or steps. we all know when the dance style is nuevo or
traditional or vals or candombe or canyengue or rock'n'roll without
referring to a list. here in buenos aires there are dedicated
alternative milongas, it is just a shame that a handful are selfish
enough and arrogant enough not to give a damn about other people's
feelings.
i have no problem with nuevo developing as a dance form, we all know
the only thing constant is change. the problem is the attitude of
those who take up neuvo with exhibitionist zeal, over inflated egos
and no consideration for others.
cheers
tony
On Mon, Oct 19, 2009 at 10:58 PM, Vince Bagu?auskas <vytis@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
> (Resent, because this borrowed computer had Rich Text as a default)
>
>
>
> Reading the further postings on Tango 2000... for Dummies and the off list emails I have recieved, raises the suggestion that, the organisers should put up a sandwich board outside the milonga door/a notice in their newsletter/internet postings etc, that says clearly and plainly what style of dancing is permitted as conditions of entry (like entry to car-parks), rather than rely on quiet hope that the music will keep the riff-raff away (it doesn't as I have said in a previous post). Maybe like thus (borrowing from Tango L and elsewhere):
>
>
>
> A/ Tango Milonga
>
> It is a social activity consisting of
>
>
> Meeting and dancing with friends old and new
> Seeking a tango trance
> Lanes that progress around the room; no zig-zagging around the middle
> Smaller 2-3 step sequences and rock steps
> Moderate strides and cautious boleos
> Maybe occasional brushes with other dancers
>
>
> B/ Authentic Argentine tango
>
> (i) What is allowed?
>
> Salon-style tango including:
>
> milonguero/apilado/petitero/caquero/Villa Urquiza
> club tango
>
> Golden age tango music from the late 30?s to the 50?s
>
>
> (ii) What is not allowed?
>
>
> Tango orillero
> Tango nuevo, including volcadas, kicks above the knee, multiple guanchos
> Fantasia/salon tango
> cayengue
> tango music post 1950?s
> alternative/neo tango music
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Thoughts?
>
>
>
> Cheers!
>
> Vince
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Click Here View photos of singles in your area
> View photos of singles in your area Click Here
> https://clk.atdmt.com/NMN/go/150855801/direct/01/
>
--
cheers
tony
