3509 Style onflict? What conflict?
Date: Tue, 14 Jun 2005 05:21:43 +0000
From: Oleh Kovalchuke <oleh_k@HOTMAIL.COM>
Subject: Style onflict? What conflict?
Where is this conflict of the styles?
I do not see any conflict of styles at all since they are quite well
separated by function and in space. Fantasy style belongs to shows and I do
not think there will be any competition in this medium from milongueros any
time soon (unless general public will suddenly get enlightened about
intricacies of social tango) .
Milonguero style belongs to social dancing and I do not think there will be
any competition from fantasy style at milongas any time soon.
Nuevo style is relatively new dialect in tango language and as such it
remains on fringes of social dance in Buenos Aires. In fact if you are nuevo
dancer and wish to dance in Buenos Aires your choice of milongas will be
rather limited, I can think of only four out of hundred or so. Of these four
one is practica.
Would I go to dance at these milongas? No (beyond curiosity visit to see
what if any I am missing).
Have I seen milongueros at these milongas? No.
Would I impose my style on a follower who dances in different style? No.
Have I seen nuevo dancers at other, not nuevo milongas in Buenos Aires? Yes.
Have they been dancing nuevo style at those milongas? No, they have changed
their style to milonguero*.
Therefore is there conflict with nuevo style in BsAs? No, they are
physically separated just like milonguero and fantasy styles.
Once more the conflict of styles is entirely artificial notion composed of
electrons in the net.
Peaceful cheers, Oleh Kovalchuke, El Ucraniano
https://TangoSpring.com
* Footnote: I do not know if nuevo dancers have experienced any inner
conflict of interests when they switched from nuevo to milonguero style at
traditional milongas in BsAs. Hence there is still a possibility for inner
conflict of interests among nuevo dancers. However I personally have not
experienced it.
PS Burak "El Turco" wrote:
"Imagine everybody does ocho cortado's or gyros in same way. Since if you
learned how to dance close embrace the different ways of doing the same move
is quite a bit limited. Therefore, you will see an uniformed dance floor.
Which might be so satisfying some people, this makes me sad."
There is no reason for your sadness, cheer up, El Turco: in my dancing in
BsAs I have not encountered two followers who would feel as if they are
doing ocho cortado or giro in the same way (notice that I am not talking
about sequence of their footsteps).
and
"They [opininated instructors or friends who suffered in BsAs milongas]
don't want to see other styles in the same dance floor because they think
other style dancers causes problem in Ronda formation."
Several obvious questions:
Would you like to elaborate why this desire to maintain ronda flow and
therefore not to bump into other dancers is wrong? A follow up question: in
this case who creates the conflict on the dance floor? Related line of
questions: being an instructor do you have an opinion on this subject? If
you do does it make you an "opinionated instructor" by any chance?
and
On festival division: If there is a market for people who wish to learn show
tango the show festivals should be organized. To my knowledge there are
quite a few show tango oriented festivals in this country already (the
festival in Austin comes to mind). It would be useful for attendees if these
festivals should be clearly defined as such. Milonguero weekends in Denver
are clearly defined as social tango oriented festivals. Hence show dancers
know that they would experience conflict of style and do not come to these
festivals. Hence the conflict of styles is avoided once more. Why even bring
it up?
Date: Thu, 16 Jun 2005 01:19:04 -0500
From: el turco <shusheta@GMAIL.COM>
Subject: Re: Style onflict? What conflict?
Dear Oleh,
good points,
you wrote;
There is no reason for your sadness, cheer up, El Turco: in my dancing in
> BsAs I have not encountered two followers who would feel as if they are
> doing ocho cortado or giro in the same way (notice that I am not talking
> about sequence of their footsteps).
>
Of course everybody has different dance personality that's what I want
to accomplish, however, in US close embrace style teachers are coming
from the same school mostly with few exceptions. I've been travelling
alot this year, and every other weekend i dance in different city with
dozens of different followers, i dance close salon, open salon, i
observe people dancing, i meet instructors students,and talk to them
about their local tango communities. What i write to this list coming
from my emprical and informal tango training -which is my favorite in
tango.
I watched you daicng several times in Denver fests, and in BsAs. All
of us have favorite ways to do same moves. However, in US the
diversity in Close embrace training is limited but more intensive
training (festivals, great teachers) than anywhere on the planet- even
better than BsAs (how many close embrace teachers you know from BsAs
5? or 10?) In US we have more 10 teachers teaching apilado-close
embrace style.
Oleh wrote:
> and
> Several obvious questions:
> Would you like to elaborate why this desire to maintain ronda flow and
> therefore not to bump into other dancers is wrong? A follow up question: in
> this case who creates the conflict on the dance floor? Related line of
> questions: being an instructor do you have an opinion on this subject? If
> you do does it make you an "opinionated instructor" by any chance?
>
Everybody likes nice ronda formation on the dance floor, however i
don't blame strangely dancing couples as cause of bad ronda, i blame
teachers who keep practical issues as secret, and not teaching social
dancing. this is something to do with bad training not bad style.
> and
>
> On festival division: If there is a market for people who wish to learn show
> tango the show festivals should be organized. To my knowledge there are
> quite a few show tango oriented festivals in this country already (the
> festival in Austin comes to mind). It would be useful for attendees if these
> festivals should be clearly defined as such. Milonguero weekends in Denver
> are clearly defined as social tango oriented festivals. Hence show dancers
> know that they would experience conflict of style and do not come to these
> festivals. Hence the conflict of styles is avoided once more. Why even bring
> it up?
I attend Denver Tango Festivals to see my old friends, study close
embrace, exchange info and experiences with other dancers. However in
the festival milonga nights, I dance like how i dance in Minneapolis
or in Seattle, or in Ankara, Turkey.
I don't dance close embrace because of the name of the festival in the
milonga.My Style is personal between my partner, music, and I.
thanks for the questions again,
Burak
Minneapolis
www.tangoshusheta.com
