819  On my way out

Date: Sat, 19 Oct 2002 13:07:26 -0700
From: Jim Maes <dancetango@EARTHLINK.NET>
Subject: On my way out

Well it seems I'm on the right track to unsubscribe. After my last try, as
I posted what worked for me, I received a confirmation that I would be
removed from list, if either I responded to a message from Tango-l or just
waited for 48 hrs. So you won't see me here very soon. I chose to wait and
see what else would come up. Sorry that my attempts got mixed in the
regular postings. Hmm "real men" a tongue in cheek. I guess, like so many
others I missed the joke. Maybe I came into the discussion too late.

So here are a few parting thoughts ( you figure out what is tongue in cheek )

Trying to define what is a "real man" or "what is Tango" is a fools quest.
To quote someone a "real man is anyone that has something hanging between
his legs, but what about transvestites? Are they still male or can we
really change "what" we are? It might be easier and more appropriate to
ask, what is a gentleman? even there we find grey areas, depending on
geographic, cultural norms. What is a real man in Afghanistan? Now there's
a place they know how to treat women :P.
(:P = Tongue in cheek) I see so many leaders who "think they know how to
dance, because they can remember a step or few, but are really tossing
women around like rag dolls, with no consideration for making her
comfortable. They seem to think that women want to be pushed, and shoved
around the floor. These same men seem oblivious to what they are doing,
they have this great big shit eating grins on their faces, like they are
SOOOO pleased with themselves, what idiots. What are they like in their
relationships? Does their dance reflect the rest of their life. Then there
are the ones that try to hard to look enthralled , looking in the ladies
eyes, or glaring at her tits,but don't see anyone else on the floor, keep
crashing into people, never excuse themselves when they collide. I often
wonder the condition of their cars, do they drive the same way? Or the ones
that stop and stand in conversation in the middle of dance traffic, then
walk across the flow without looking both ways. Didn't your MAMA teach you
better? Some of this behavior is acceptable from newbies, but I see people
that have been at the dance for years, guilty and seemingly not wanting to
look at themselves. For you I say, try taking a video of your dancing, then
go out and shoot yourself. A point to you ladies ( what is a real LADY??)
I've had you come sit after one of those gymnastic, or even simpler dances
where you were not danced well, you complain about it, yet the next time
they ask, you sheepishly go out and suffer abuse again. Duh what is that
about. Why is it any different than anywhere else in life. Why can't you
say NO to these idiots? Would you say yes to other things they ask? Would
you go out on a date with someone that has no manners, and doesn't pay
attention to how uncomfortable they make you? If you were in any other
place, how would you respond if a man were looking in your eyes, as if he
could see the back of your head, in hopes of finding your soul? How would
you respond if he were staring at your tits, and/or eyes and walked in
front of a moving car. Stop being so desperate that you'll dance with
fools, just so you're not a wall flower. Also many times, I've watched
women that are good solid dancers with one of these brainless jerks, come
off the floor, and then I dance with them and they can't even follow a
simple lead, or the guy was bouncing up and down and now the woman is still
bouncing. These guys ruin all the hard work you've put into your dance. You
work very hard, learning how to follow and look pretty, but they make you
regress, and now it takes 3 dances to get you back into flow, and my time
is not supposed to be about damage control. JUST SAY NO. Since the 60s,
women have tried to take their place as equals with men, so why can't you
ask the better dancers for a dance? The ones that are "real men" :P will be
glad to share a few moments with a woman that is their equal, and will
respect you for it. If a man can't respect your being forward then maybe
they are not gentlemen. To all the leaders I say, take your time, place the
woman in EVERY step, pay attention to traffic, or get the f--k off the
floor, and make room for the real men :) Go, for the rest of your life as a
wanna be tanguero, to beginning classes, and work on technique as well as
new patterns. Learn how to treat women as ladies, if you find one, and
always assume that you have found one, until proven otherwise. If you treat
your life partners like you do on the dance floor, I feel sorry for your
women!!!

I sometimes wonder if the Argentines are laughing behind their hands and
our backs at us. My disclaimer is that I have not been to Argentine, but I
have seen video and asked many questions of those that have, and watched
them dance socially here. The consensus is that they rarely do figures at a
milonga there. that they dance almost exclusively salon style, or at least
simply. If they do anything fancy, it is usually late in the milonga, or as
part of a demonstration, but not on a crowded floor. Oh yeah, back to them
laughing at us. We are so dense that we see fancy stuff, and think that's
tango. Yes it is, but is it for the social floor? Can't you tell the
difference? We, myself included have been impressed with all the show
stuff, to the point that if they try to teach us technique, we don't like
it. yet we go out on the floor and try stuff that is beyond our skill and
technique and LOOK LIKE SHIT.

Well, I have a few more thoughts, I may get them in later, if I'm not
blessed with being removed from this list, but for this moment I need to go
do some work.

Since it's just hours away till I'm officially of this list I may not even
see your responses to my personal feelings. If you want to make sure I hear
what you have to say you can send a separate mail to;

dancetango@earthlink.net

Keep trying.
Maybe someday I'll learn how to do this thing they call Tango, If I can
ever figure out "what is tango all about

Best to all

Jim