4424 El Nino Bien Thursday Nights
Date: Fri, 30 Jun 2006 00:20:10 -0300
From: "Christopher L. Everett" <ceverett@ceverett.com>
Subject: [Tango-L] El Nino Bien Thursday Nights
It's more fun in a group. If you're in BsAs and want to go,
let's meet and greet someplace beforehand, then go as a gang.
Email me at ceverett@ceverett.com
Christopher
Date: Sat, 02 Feb 2008 07:33:26 -0700
From: Nina Pesochinsky <nina@earthnet.net>
Subject: [Tango-L] Nino Bien
When Nino Bien just started, it was a lovely, elegant
milonga. People were very excited. I remember when in the whole
place there would be maybe only 5-6 foreign dancers. In August,
there would be more because of the European vacations, but not many
more. This was around 1998-99.
Then things began to change. As the number of foregners increased
everywhere, there became more and more of them at Nino Bien. Now it
is a boring sitting milonga where the Argentine dancers go to hang
out with their friends and see their foreign students. Most refuse
to dance for fear of being hit on the head with someone's heel or
something like that. There are usually more foreigners at Nino Bien
than the Argentines. But this is a trend of all evening milongas and
one has to be creative in his/her search for the real milonga without
the foreigners. Such milongas do exist.
However, the restaurant downstairs at Nino Bien serves exquisite food
and deserts, which you can order upstairs at the milonga are also great.
NIna
Date: Sat, 2 Feb 2008 08:49:18 -0600
From: "Clif Davis" <clif@clifdavis.com>
Subject: Re: [Tango-L] Nino Bien
Since the overall attitude seems to be "anti-foreigners" and how they are
ruining the dance and milonga's, I think ALL foreigners should stop going to
BsAs and that would solve the problem. I mean, they obviously don't enjoy us
coming there and spending money, so, let's go somewhere where we will be
treated with some modicum of respect.
But hey, that is just the old guy from Texas.
clif
-----Original Message-----
Sent: Saturday, February 02, 2008 8:33 AM
Subject: [Tango-L] Nino Bien
When Nino Bien just started, it was a lovely, elegant
milonga. People were very excited. I remember when in the whole
place there would be maybe only 5-6 foreign dancers. In August,
there would be more because of the European vacations, but not many
more. This was around 1998-99.
Then things began to change. As the number of foregners increased
everywhere, there became more and more of them at Nino Bien. Now it
is a boring sitting milonga where the Argentine dancers go to hang
out with their friends and see their foreign students. Most refuse
to dance for fear of being hit on the head with someone's heel or
something like that. There are usually more foreigners at Nino Bien
than the Argentines. But this is a trend of all evening milongas and
one has to be creative in his/her search for the real milonga without
the foreigners. Such milongas do exist.
However, the restaurant downstairs at Nino Bien serves exquisite food
and deserts, which you can order upstairs at the milonga are also great.
NIna
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Date: Sat, 2 Feb 2008 06:59:56 -0800 (PST)
From: NANCY <ningle_2000@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Tango-L] Nino Bien
--- Nina Pesochinsky <nina@earthnet.net> wrote:
>
> Then things began to change. As the number of
> foregners increased
> everywhere, there became more and more of them at
> Nino Bien. Now it
> is a boring sitting milonga where the Argentine
> dancers go to hang
> out with their friends and see their foreign
> students.
That is not true of the Saturday afternoon milonga (
Los Consegrados). Many a day I was the only foreigner
there in a crowd of 250.
<<Rito es la danza en tu vida
y el tango que tu amas
te quema en su llama>>
de: Bailarina de tango
por: Horacio Sanguinetti
Be a better friend, newshound, and
Date: Sat, 02 Feb 2008 08:12:28 -0700
From: Nina Pesochinsky <nina@earthnet.net>
Subject: Re: [Tango-L] Nino Bien
I remember a quote, but don't know where it was from, maybe a movie.
"Those damn foreigners have been ruining things for us ever since we
came to this country!". Doe anyone one know the exact line and where
it was from?
Foreigner in BsAs are a great thing for the economy, good for tango
business, and really bad news for the quality of the milongas.
Foreigners bring with them anxieties that belong to their own
cultures, as well as nervous energy to dance a lot in a short time
that they are there. If they live in BsAs, it is differnt. The
foreign dancers who live in BsAs are calm and blend with the
Argentine flow of the milongas. But those who are there for only a
couple of weeks, show up with anxiety to dance as much as possible,
which changes the values placed on dacing in the milongas.
In my experience, milongas that are overwhelmen by foreigners are
anxious, nervous milongas that do not have the intensity and danger
of a true Argentine milonga. They are boring. Foreigners dance with
technical precision and no passion, ad that is a cultural handicap
that cannot be changed by just talking about it.
The point of going to BsAs is to live and breath the culture that
gave rise to tango, to absorb the energy and the feel without word,
to experience something that cannot be experienced any place
else. To be surrounded by the foreigners and the feeling and their
own culture that they bring to tango, one does not need to go to
BsAs. He/she can just stay in their own countries.
Best,
Nina
At 07:49 AM 2/2/2008, Clif Davis wrote:
>Since the overall attitude seems to be "anti-foreigners" and how they are
>ruining the dance and milonga's, I think ALL foreigners should stop going to
>BsAs and that would solve the problem. I mean, they obviously don't enjoy us
>coming there and spending money, so, let's go somewhere where we will be
>treated with some modicum of respect.
>
>But hey, that is just the old guy from Texas.
>clif
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: tango-l-bounces@mit.edu [mailto:tango-l-bounces@mit.edu] On Behalf Of
>Nina Pesochinsky
>Sent: Saturday, February 02, 2008 8:33 AM
>Subject: [Tango-L] Nino Bien
>
>When Nino Bien just started, it was a lovely, elegant
>milonga. People were very excited. I remember when in the whole
>place there would be maybe only 5-6 foreign dancers. In August,
>there would be more because of the European vacations, but not many
>more. This was around 1998-99.
>
>Then things began to change. As the number of foregners increased
>everywhere, there became more and more of them at Nino Bien. Now it
>is a boring sitting milonga where the Argentine dancers go to hang
>out with their friends and see their foreign students. Most refuse
>to dance for fear of being hit on the head with someone's heel or
>something like that. There are usually more foreigners at Nino Bien
>than the Argentines. But this is a trend of all evening milongas and
>one has to be creative in his/her search for the real milonga without
>the foreigners. Such milongas do exist.
>
>However, the restaurant downstairs at Nino Bien serves exquisite food
>and deserts, which you can order upstairs at the milonga are also great.
>
>NIna
>
>
>__________ NOD32 2844 (20080201) Information __________
>
>This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system.
>https://www.eset.com
>
>
Date: Sat, 02 Feb 2008 08:15:36 -0700
From: Nina Pesochinsky <nina@earthnet.net>
Subject: Re: [Tango-L] Nino Bien
That is true, but that is not the original Nino Bien milonga. It
came later.The one I am referring to is on Thursday night.
At 07:59 AM 2/2/2008, NANCY wrote:
>--- Nina Pesochinsky <nina@earthnet.net> wrote:
>
> >
> > Then things began to change. As the number of
> > foregners increased
> > everywhere, there became more and more of them at
> > Nino Bien. Now it
> > is a boring sitting milonga where the Argentine
> > dancers go to hang
> > out with their friends and see their foreign
> > students.
>
>That is not true of the Saturday afternoon milonga (
>Los Consegrados). Many a day I was the only foreigner
>there in a crowd of 250.
>
>
>
>
><<Rito es la danza en tu vida
> y el tango que tu amas
> te quema en su llama>>
>de: Bailarina de tango
>por: Horacio Sanguinetti
>
>
>
>Be a better friend, newshound, and
Date: Sat, 02 Feb 2008 16:17:32 +0100
From: "Christian L?then" <christian.luethen@gmx.net>
Subject: Re: [Tango-L] Nino Bien
I think clif hit a very important point, even if his 'ALL foreigners' statement may be on the strong side.
> Since the overall attitude seems to be "anti-foreigners" and how they are
> ruining the dance and milonga's, I think ALL foreigners should stop going
> to BsAs and that would solve the problem.
As far true as it would be if all foreigners all of a sudden would stop to go to - let's say Venice - for comparison. Tango originates from Buenos Aires, no doubts, but without foreigners taking it to the rest of the world and actually also taking it back from there tango would have either stayed small and unrecognized or be long time gone.
> I mean, they obviously don't enjoy us
> coming there and spending money,
Absolutely true. Sometimes one thinks being a masochist paying a lot of money to travel down to Buenos Aires only to be looked at from high above while being there.
> so, let's go somewhere where we will be
> treated with some modicum of respect.
Maybe one reason why a lot of americans travel over to TangoMagia-Festival in Amsterdam, Holland, at the end of each year. And why europeans travel over to the U.S. for ie. Portland Tango Oktoberfest or Denver Tango Fest. There's (at least) a lot of high class dancing outside of Buenos Aires.
> But hey, that is just the old guy from Texas.
Same here: just a guy from Central Europe.
Christian
--
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Date: Sat, 02 Feb 2008 08:30:23 -0700
From: Nina Pesochinsky <nina@earthnet.net>
Subject: Re: [Tango-L] Nino Bien
The only people that complain about the
foreigners are those who know what it was like
without them. The others will never know the difference and have fun anyway.
Nina
At 08:17 AM 2/2/2008, Christian L?then wrote:
>I think clif hit a very important point, even if
>his 'ALL foreigners' statement may be on the strong side.
>
>
> > Since the overall attitude seems to be "anti-foreigners" and how they are
> > ruining the dance and milonga's, I think ALL foreigners should stop going
> > to BsAs and that would solve the problem.
>As far true as it would be if all foreigners all
>of a sudden would stop to go to - let's say
>Venice - for comparison. Tango originates from
>Buenos Aires, no doubts, but without foreigners
>taking it to the rest of the world and actually
>also taking it back from there tango would have
>either stayed small and unrecognized or be long time gone.
>
>
> > I mean, they obviously don't enjoy us
> > coming there and spending money,
>Absolutely true. Sometimes one thinks being a
>masochist paying a lot of money to travel down
>to Buenos Aires only to be looked at from high above while being there.
>
>
> > so, let's go somewhere where we will be
> > treated with some modicum of respect.
>Maybe one reason why a lot of americans travel
>over to TangoMagia-Festival in Amsterdam,
>Holland, at the end of each year. And why
>europeans travel over to the U.S. for ie.
>Portland Tango Oktoberfest or Denver Tango Fest.
>There's (at least) a lot of high class dancing outside of Buenos Aires.
>
>
> > But hey, that is just the old guy from Texas.
>Same here: just a guy from Central Europe.
>
>Christian
>
>--
>Psssst! Schon vom neuen GMX MultiMessenger geh?rt?
>Der kann`s mit allen: https://www.gmx.net/de/go/multimessenger
Date: Sat, 2 Feb 2008 15:32 +0000 (GMT Standard Time)
From: "Chris, UK" <tl2@chrisjj.com>
Subject: Re: [Tango-L] Nino Bien
Cc: tl2@chrisjj.com
Christian wrote:
> Maybe one reason why a lot of americans travel over to
> TangoMagia-Festival in Amsterdam, Holland, at the end of each year.
They must keep a very low profile. I recall seeing very few (North)
Americans at winter Tangomagia in the last five years.
Nancy wrote:
> The List Owner has the right and the responsibility to impose any
> retrictions on the List he wishes. If you don't like it, start
> your own list with your own rules.
I like this list fine, thanks...
> Some folks are real tired of your little catfights and the too
> frequent postings.
... but I'm sorry to hear that you don't. We'll be sad to see you go.
--
Chris
Date: Sat, 2 Feb 2008 10:51:36 EST
From: MACFroggy@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Tango-L] Nino Bien
As a foreigner who has lived in Buenos Aires for 4 years,
I have to say that foreign dancers who come here on vacation
bring an added energy to the milongas. Also,, the locals who
enjoy dancing with them come out more in the "temporada de
los extranjeros." So there's more energy from local dancers as
well.
Sure, it changes the milonga's ambience: especially if a large foreign tour
group comes in, but sometimes it makes it better and more
interesting.
Cherie
https://tangocherie.blogspot.com/
**************
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Date: Sat, 02 Feb 2008 11:45:38 -0500
From: sherpal1@aol.com
Subject: [Tango-L] nino bien
To: TANGO-L@mit.edu
Thanks to the tango gods, I have learned which months to travel to BA to avoid the huge
influx of tourtists, I have learned which milongos to go to, which days and hours, which people
to dance with. I have learnedto go into the provinces around BA where neighbors and
couples and singles go to dine,drink, dance and be convivial and social, who know which
tango is playing after the first three notes and who can sing the lettras?in your ear as they
hold you in their loving embrace.? They know that it is the woman who should be shown
off, with her style not her tricks, they cherish the pause, they honor her ability to inter
lead in an elegant dance conversation.? It took ten years and over a dozen and a half trips
to BA to learn this from their cultural perspective.IT is not instantly acquired knowledge and
that is why it is so valuable.?
I personally would not want to dance with some of these people on the?list who
have so much resentment andbitterness in their hearts.? BEst to stay home and not
infect the floors in BA.
I agree, Nino Bien has not been good since '99,? It really became sort of a pickup place
where foreigners took the culturally disapproved of oppourtunity to correct their partners
on the dance floor.
?
That place is a fool's paradise.
Sherrie
More new features than ever. Check out the new AOL Mail ! - https://webmail.aol.com
Date: Sat, 2 Feb 2008 13:38:02 -0200
From: "robin tara" <robinctara@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Tango-L] Nino Bien
To: tango-l@mit.edu
<9e1cc4860802020738q4142d664k7a97d82c04060ad4@mail.gmail.com>
A word of caution to those who want to be welcomed at milongas in BA: Be
careful what and who you write about. Although there is freedom of speech
here in BA, some milonga organizers will ban you from their milongas if you
write something even mildly unpleasant about their venues. I witnessed this
happening at a milonga recently. A guest had written about an unfortunate
experience at that particular milonga and when the organizer saw that she
was there, she attacked her verbally, saying that she was not welcome and
that she should be careful of her passport because the milonga organizer
could have her kicked out of the country. This was not a quiet, private
conversation. It was screamed out at high volume. Unbelievable!
Maybe I won't be welcomed back there again. I'll let you know.
Date: Sat, 2 Feb 2008 17:49:37 -0700
From: skindance@juno.com
Subject: Re: [Tango-L] Nino Bien
To: clif@clifdavis.com
Cc: tango-l@mit.edu
"But hey, that is just the old guy from Texas."
Yup! BsAs is bein affected just like Texas when it started bein invaded
by furrners!
An even older guy and dancer
On Sat, 2 Feb 2008 08:49:18 -0600 "Clif Davis" <clif@clifdavis.com>
writes:
> Since the overall attitude seems to be "anti-foreigners" and how they
> are
> ruining the dance and milonga's, I think ALL foreigners should stop
> going to
> BsAs and that would solve the problem. I mean, they obviously don't
> enjoy us
> coming there and spending money, so, let's go somewhere where we
> will be
> treated with some modicum of respect.
>
> But hey, that is just the old guy from Texas.
> clif
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: tango-l-bounces@mit.edu [mailto:tango-l-bounces@mit.edu] On
> Behalf Of
> Nina Pesochinsky
> Sent: Saturday, February 02, 2008 8:33 AM
> Subject: [Tango-L] Nino Bien
>
> When Nino Bien just started, it was a lovely, elegant
> milonga. People were very excited. I remember when in the whole
> place there would be maybe only 5-6 foreign dancers. In August,
> there would be more because of the European vacations, but not many
>
> more. This was around 1998-99.
>
> Then things began to change. As the number of foregners increased
> everywhere, there became more and more of them at Nino Bien. Now it
>
> is a boring sitting milonga where the Argentine dancers go to hang
> out with their friends and see their foreign students. Most refuse
>
> to dance for fear of being hit on the head with someone's heel or
> something like that. There are usually more foreigners at Nino Bien
>
> than the Argentines. But this is a trend of all evening milongas
> and
> one has to be creative in his/her search for the real milonga
> without
> the foreigners. Such milongas do exist.
>
> However, the restaurant downstairs at Nino Bien serves exquisite
> food
> and deserts, which you can order upstairs at the milonga are also
> great.
>
> NIna
>
>
> _______ NOD32 2844 (20080201) Information __________
>
> This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system.
> https://www.eset.com
>
>
>
>
Date: Mon, 4 Feb 2008 09:59:07 +1100
From: Victor Bennetts <Victor_Bennetts@infosys.com>
Subject: Re: [Tango-L] Nino Bien
<EBAF6BD07D1C6C42AF55D51893B4C6DA0256643DEA@AUSMELMBX01.ad.infosys.com>
I was with you up until this point. There are plenty of non Argentinians who dance with passion (myself included) and when I was in BsAs I saw some woeful Argentinian dancers, even some who sit at the head tables. So I am yet to be convinced the milongas of the 90s were any kind of dancer's paradise. Of the milongas I went to there might have been one or two foreign couples dancing inappropriately, but on the whole I thought the foreigners were pretty respectful and restrained on the floor. By far the worst disturbance at Nino Bien of the two nights I was there was when a pair of young local kids determined to dance disco in the middle of the floor, but they were pretty drunk and not up for all that long. That sort of phenomena is not unique to BsAs, it has happened from time to time in Melbourne as well :-). As I have said before Nino Bien is a great milonga because the organiser is so thoughtful and I will always be grateful that he looked after my wife so well the two nig!
hts she was there. He remembered her the second night and offered her the same table and when he saw she had brought her husband, asked if I wanted to sit a couple of tables away so we could be apart but dance together when we wanted. You don't get that kind of attention anywhere else and to my mind it is really special and all class. So I don't really care if it is better or worse, its still beautiful and I love it anyway. Those nights were amongst the best I had in BsAs and far from it being all foreigners, I got to dance with about an even mix of Argentinians and extranjeros. And the foreign followers (US, Canadian, Italian, etc) were all first rate (not to mention beautiful ;-)).
Nina >Foreigners dance with
>technical precision and no passion, ad that is a cultural handicap
>that cannot be changed by just talking about it.
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