5643 Lots of questions
Date: Tue, 12 May 2009 17:03:00 -0700 (PDT)
From: Ming Mar <ming_mar@yahoo.com>
Subject: [Tango-L] Lots of questions
To: tango-l@mit.edu
Pat Petronio writes:
>As a woman in tango, the feeling of being transported in
>the dance is absolutely the result of quality of movement,
>and my partner's connection with me & the music
What is good quality movement? What is bad quality
movement? How can you tell if your own movement is high
quality or low? Can people be trained to do this? If so,
how do you train people to do high quality movement?
What is connection with someone? What is the difference
between good connection and bad connection? How can you
tell if you're giving good connection? Can people be
trained to do this? If so, how do you train people to do
good connection?
What is connection with music? What is the difference
between good connection and ban connection or no
connection? Can people be trained to do this? If so, how
do you train people to do good connection with the music?
Date: Wed, 13 May 2009 12:04:35 +1000
From: Noughts <damian.thompson@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Tango-L] Lots of questions
To: ming_mar@yahoo.com
Cc: tango-l@mit.edu
<cb8208d0905121904w6d5b7988l79f7e46bc79a93e0@mail.gmail.com>
Again, a very very subjective subject....
Is strong and fast good? Or slow and smooth?
All dependant upon taste and familiarity.
I know some amazing looking dancers that love firm hard movements to give
definition and others that need a breath of air past their cheek and they
will respond....
One you enjoy I suspect will be the quality that you are looking for....
2009/5/13 Ming Mar <ming_mar@yahoo.com>
>
> Pat Petronio writes:
> >As a woman in tango, the feeling of being transported in
> >the dance is absolutely the result of quality of movement,
> >and my partner's connection with me & the music
>
> What is good quality movement? What is bad quality
> movement? How can you tell if your own movement is high
> quality or low? Can people be trained to do this? If so,
> how do you train people to do high quality movement?
>
> What is connection with someone? What is the difference
> between good connection and bad connection? How can you
> tell if you're giving good connection? Can people be
> trained to do this? If so, how do you train people to do
> good connection?
>
> What is connection with music? What is the difference
> between good connection and ban connection or no
> connection? Can people be trained to do this? If so, how
> do you train people to do good connection with the music?
>
>
>
>
Date: Wed, 13 May 2009 12:05:02 +1000
From: Noughts <damian.thompson@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Tango-L] Lots of questions
To: ming_mar@yahoo.com
Cc: tango-l@mit.edu
<cb8208d0905121905x732a93b4g3721043d9dcd9619@mail.gmail.com>
Again, a very very subjective subject....
Is strong and fast good? Or slow and smooth?
All dependant upon taste and familiarity.
I know some amazing looking dancers that love firm hard movements to
give definition and others that need a breath of air past their cheek
and they will respond....
One you enjoy I suspect will be the quality that you are looking for....
Date: Tue, 12 May 2009 22:29:16 EDT
From: Crrtango@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Tango-L] Lots of questions
To: TANGO-L@mit.edu
I don't know your dancing level, but if you are a beginning dancer, these
are not things that you should be concerned about.?Tango is difficult and
takes time and practice to just get a good foundation. That takes enough
concentration and effort to keep you busy without worrying about whether you
connect or not. And even if you aren't a beginner, you can't just find the
answers to these questions as if they were math formulas.? First you have to
learn to dance well (and hopefully learn from someone with good technique.)
Connection to music or your partner are not things that can be taught, they
are something you feel when you are comfortable enough with your dancing to
be able to relax and not have to be think about how to do steps correctly and
in turn be able to appreciate the nuances of the music.? If you spend your
time looking for the answers to these questions as if they something finite
and concrete you will never learn to dance.?Someone might be able to teach
you quality of movement because that is often about having good technique
(but not exclusively and even then it supposes a certain level of expertise)
but the connection to your partner or the music comes from within you and is
more of an emotional feeling.?If someone claims that they can teach you
connection, you should find another teacher.
Charles
**************
A Good Credit Score is 700 or Above. See yours in just
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Date: Wed, 13 May 2009 04:32:35 +0000
From: Sergio Vandekier <sergiovandekier990@hotmail.com>
Subject: [Tango-L] Lots of questions
To: Tango-L List <tango-l@mit.edu>
Connection in Argentine Tango (IMO) is dual, physical and spiritual.
The physical connection develops and improves as you learn the rich and intricate technique of the dance.
The better your technique, the better your posture, the more precise your movements and placement of your feet, as well as more relaxed and comfortable the embrace.
Connection with the music is achieved by listening to it, as you listen your understanding of the music and the rhythm becomes deeper, you start distinguishing the different instruments and their conversation.
You may develop connection to the music without dancing; but when and if you dance your dance will become more harmonious and relaxed.
The Spiritual connection to your partner and to the music develops as you dedicate time to learn to dance well,
in harmony with yourself, your partner, the music and all the other dancers on the floor. It happens slowly, with time and appear when you do not expect it.
At certain point your physical and spiritual relationship to your partner become intermingled, she surrenders to you and you surrender to her embrace.
Then as you dance, the music and the other dancers seem to quiet down, you can still hear the music as the floor becomes absent, you go floating around the room, in perfect harmony till the music stops and you take her back to her table, you have a warm, peaceful, sensation in your chest, and you know that after a while you will be looking for her eyes to invite her to dance again,...and she will accept with a smile .
BEst regards, Sergio
Insert movie times and more without leaving Hotmail?.
https://windowslive.com/Tutorial/Hotmail/QuickAdd?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_HM_Tutorial_QuickAdd1_052009
Date: Wed, 13 May 2009 04:31:30 -0700 (PDT)
From: Jack Dylan <jackdylan007@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Tango-L] Lots of questions
To: TANGO-L@mit.edu
For once, I completely disagree with Charles.
My teacher likes to tell beginners that an 8-week beginner course
is ALL about developing a connection with your partner. Until you
do that, you're dancing alone and that just isn't Tango at all.
Any good teacher should be able to connect with a female student
quite quickly and she'll then know what a good connection is and
she'll be able to dance Tango with any good leader. For the men,
I agree that it's a lot more difficult but it's still what he should be
aiming for from the very first set of?lessons.
What's the alternative - just learn some steps?
Tango without a connection is nothing.
Jack
?
> From: "Crrtango@aol.com" Crrtango@aol.com
>?
?>Tango is difficult and
> takes time and practice to just get a good foundation. That takes enough
> concentration and effort to keep you busy without worrying about whether you
> connect or not.?
>
Date: Wed, 13 May 2009 13:05:31 -0400
From: Steve Littler <sl@stevelittler.com>
Subject: Re: [Tango-L] Lots of questions
To: ming_mar@yahoo.com
Cc: tango-l@mit.edu
Ming Mar wrote:
> Pat Petronio writes:
>
>> As a woman in tango, the feeling of being transported in
>> the dance is absolutely the result of quality of movement,
>> and my partner's connection with me & the music
>>
>
> What is good quality movement? What is bad quality
> movement? How can you tell if your own movement is high
> quality or low? Can people be trained to do this? If so,
> how do you train people to do high quality movement?
>
Yes. Dance with your teacher or an intermediate partner in a private
lesson, practice or practica environment and get immediate feedback on
what you are doing and you can be trained. It can be discouraging at
first, but the rewards are worth it.
> What is connection with someone? What is the difference
> between good connection and bad connection? How can you
> tell if you're giving good connection? Can people be
> trained to do this? If so, how do you train people to do
> good connection?
>
Connection starts with good posture, a mutual warm embrace, and feels
good and comfortable to both partners. Poor posture breaks the
connection (standing vertical or back on heels, not forward like you
should.) Holding the partner too tight, lifting partner up (except on
certain steps that require it), dropping your weight on your partner
break connection. Bad basic technique breaks connection. Good technique
enhances it.
And as Sergio said, there is the Spiritual aspect. Where the lady
surrenders to you. She does this when she trusts you and she can tell by
your embrace, certainty, confidence and respect that you will take care
of her on the dance floor and she will be safe in your arms. You can
feel the surrender when she relaxes in your arms and responds to your
signals/lead/mark. My first care for the lady is that I protect her,
that she will not get bumped or stepped on in a crowded dance floor
(because she is dancing backwards in heels with her eyes closed.) She
will sense that. Then I care for connection and musicality. Then with
all that buzzing in my head, I have to detach from the mental noise,
relax and enjoy the dance myself. Then we are really connected and
dancing together as one.
> What is connection with music? What is the difference
> between good connection and ban connection or no
> connection? Can people be trained to do this? If so, how
> do you train people to do good connection with the music?
>
Get into a musicality class or workshop. Typically in the classes I've
been in, we listen to the music (Tango has a 4 beat measure) and then
the teacher has us practice stepping on the 1, or the 1 & 3, or 1-2-3.
Then we practice pausing at certain points, either at the end of a
phrase, at slow points, random points. Drills like this train you to
feel the music. And if you don't speak Spanish, finding translations of
the songs titles and words helps deepen your understanding of the song
and adds extra feeling and dimension to your dance. (
I've had troubles finding translations of many songs. Maybe someone else
can post a comprehensive list of translations at some point.)
El Stevito de Gainesville
Date: Wed, 13 May 2009 18:10:40 -0400
From: "Michael" <tangomaniac@cavtel.net>
Subject: Re: [Tango-L] Lots of questions
To: <ming_mar@yahoo.com>, <tango-l@mit.edu>
A lot of good questions. I don't know that I have a lot of good answers. I'm
not going to respond question question.
When I took yoga, I learned that every person has a mind, body, and soul.
Sometimes they are in sync with each other and sometimes they aren't.
When I started learning tango, I used mostly my mind and it looked like
others did the same. We tried to mimic the instructor. When I moved onto
private lessons, I was better able to focus and understand. My teacher, Joe,
said "It's not the WHAT that is important, but the HOW." Many times I'd
analyze what I was doing. After a long while, I developed technique and
didn't have to think so much of execution.. But then, the body took over and
I focused on how something felt. I could feel that a figure didn't work
because somebody was in the wrong place or on the wrong foot. I had to use
the brain to figure out what went wrong. Instead of knowing when something
was wrong, I moved on to feeling when something was wrong. My body told me
about quality of movement, e.g. did I complete my pivots? My body told me
how the woman was following though not if I was misleading or the woman not
following.
I'm not sure anybody can be taught connection. However, people can be taught
to relax, which is the key to connection. I went to yoga for 3 years where
the yoga therapist squeezed the tension out of me like toothpaste out of the
tube. I didn't realize how stiff I was and that I was gripping the woman,
not embracing her.
To me, connection is like batteries in a flashlight. Either there is
connection and the light comes on because the batteries are facing the
correct direction or the light doesn't come on because a battery is facing
the wrong direction.
How do you know when you have good connection? HMMM. That's like asking
"when do you know you're in love?" Only the body and soul can answer that
question. I have the best connection when my partner is relaxed with a firm,
but soft frame. There's no pulling or pushing. We move to the music without
rushing. When I lead a stepover, I feel when she's finished her pivot with
or without an adornment. On rare occasions, I've felt my heartbeat or her
heartbeat.
Questions about learning apply to the mind. I'm not sure how to train the
body for connection. Connection to music? All I can suggest is to put on
music and walk in the privacy of your house, thinking only of your
movements. Your body will let you know if you're in sync with the music.
Michael
I danced Argentine Tango - - with the Argentines
